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ZBrush2 TriBeast in trueSpace7
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These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
ZBrush2 TriBeast in trueSpace7 // Work in Progress
Post by Alien // Jun 23, 2006, 4:30am
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Alien
Total Posts: 1231
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Wouldn't be very Swedish of me to brag, we're a shy and humble people :D
I never thought I'd ever hear the word "shy" being used to describe the Swedish! :p |
Post by parva // Jun 23, 2006, 4:38am
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parva
Total Posts: 822
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Looks fantastic Shike!
Eyes... funny situation many years ago as I looked very close into the eyes from a billy goat as I was on a farm - these dark strokes horizontal not vertical like a cat was enough to scare me :D
maybe a try not round but another shape.
P.S.: tomorrow world cup German against Sweden :cool: |
Post by Shike // Jun 23, 2006, 5:32am
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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I never thought I'd ever hear the word "shy" being used to describe the Swedish! :p
Well... liberal and drinks-a-lot then ;)
Looks fantastic Shike!
Eyes... ..billy goat ..these dark strokes horizontal not vertical like a cat was enough to scare me ..maybe try not round but another shape.
P.S.: tomorrow world cup German against Sweden
Thanks ! Ah, the billy goat eyes... found some when Googling, and yeah, they are creepy. No wonder that they over the history has been connected to evil. ;)
Problem with that kind of weird eye is that it looks so unreal... even on a billy goat, the mind tells me something is wrong.
Still, I might test something like that :)
P.S. Luckily I don't follow football... so I wont go :banana: if Germany wins :D |
Post by MadMouse // Jun 23, 2006, 8:13am
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MadMouse
Total Posts: 1069
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Even with the wrong texture that eye is sure looking (no pun intended:D ) sweet. I'd look at other herbivore eyes, maybe cows or giraffes. Just an idea;)
Steve |
Post by Shike // Jun 24, 2006, 2:29am
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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Even with the wrong texture that eye is sure looking (no pun intended:D ) sweet. I'd look at other herbivore eyes, maybe cows or giraffes. Just an idea;)
Thanks, and I've actually looked a bit at cow-eyes, and the "colored eyepart" (too lazy to look it up in the dictionary ;) ) is bigger than what I have now, and almost nothing of the "white" is visible...and it seems more yellowish...
I think that will be the direction I'm going...and maybe some weird billygoat (or lizard) eyeslot. :D |
Post by Shike // Jun 24, 2006, 2:43am
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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Here are the first experiments with high frequency detailing.
So far only for the dark and light skin, nothing on the "bumpy beige" parts.
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This was done with the help of DarkTree2.5 in which I can create procedural (fractal) materials, and even load the ZBrush (or trueSpace) object to get it's UV-coordinates and render texture/normal maps that fits perfectly.
(better to use Maps than a multilayer material with procedural shaders...since with maps I have the possibility to render in VRay if I want to)
Here I'm using one greyscale texturemap used in photoshop to darken the ZBrush texture. Also one Normal map.
In ZB I've painted a mask which is used in photoshop to combine the Darktree texture and normal map with the ones from ZBrush. |
Post by MadMouse // Jun 24, 2006, 3:09am
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MadMouse
Total Posts: 1069
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Seriously good Lars. I'm most impressed :) |
Post by chrono // Jun 24, 2006, 3:41am
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chrono
Total Posts: 0
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Solid texture work, but that eye really doesn't work, unless your trying to humanize the creature. And the level of detail difference between the eye and it's surrounding area is pretty noticable. So it's something that you may want to address.
The rest is good for normal mapping. |
Post by brianalldridge // Jun 24, 2006, 6:56am
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brianalldridge
Total Posts: 397
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unless your trying to humanize the creature.
I kind of like it, it gives it this intelligent\peacful look, the black eyes made it look mean |
Post by Shike // Jun 24, 2006, 2:12pm
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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Seriously good Lars. I'm most impressed :)
Thanks :o
Solid texture work, but that eye really doesn't work, unless your trying to humanize the creature. And the level of detail difference between the eye and it's surrounding area is pretty noticable. So it's something that you may want to address.
You're quite right about the detail difference, the eye texture is 2000x2000 and the entire TriBeast is 3500x3500. When I've created a new eye, with bigger "colored area" (still havn't looked up the correct word ;) ) I'll try to remember to keep the texture size down. :)
I kind of like it, it gives it this intelligent\peacful look, the black eyes made it look mean.
Yep, the black eyes might have worked on a carnivore. ;)
But I'll try to make it even more friendly...bigger "colored area" should do the trick.... I think. :rolleyes:
Some updates - Now I've added highfrequency normal map to the rest:
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And reworked the spine ( I'm back to the 120k polygon again since it renders faster...that's the reason for the rough silhouette.)
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I think the stretched stuff is caused by the Darktree generated normal-map....because the texture I painted in ZBrush doesn't look like that...have to look into that.:confused: |
Post by mrbones // Jun 24, 2006, 3:25pm
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mrbones
Total Posts: 1280
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Is that a realtime image or v ray render? Either way It looks really good. Nice little critter guy.
Id throw him a cracker at the zoo. Whoops there goes my fingers... |
Post by MadMouse // Jun 25, 2006, 1:20am
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MadMouse
Total Posts: 1069
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Hummmm? still not sure about the eye texture to be honest. I cant put my finger on why buy it doesn't quite fit in my eyes. Other than that she/he looks great. Do you have a scene in mind? I imagine the beasty grazing on a open plain perhaps with a couple of alien hunters stalking it?
ATB
Steve |
Post by Shike // Jun 25, 2006, 4:31am
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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Is that a realtime image or v ray render? Either way It looks really good. Nice little critter guy.
Id throw him a cracker at the zoo. Whoops there goes my fingers...
Thanks ! :)
It's LightWorks HDRI.
Primary reason:
VRay and Player doesn't seem to like smooth shading ( EDIT: I WAS WRONG, see next post, autofacet 80deg solved it :o)
It looks pretty ok in VRay and Player with the 500k poly model...but I prefer this lowpoly model when I'm still in WIP-mode. ;)
Secondary reason:
I would like to use a specularity map...and so far I don't think that is supported by VRay. (Though it probably is by the time I'm finished ;) )
Hummmm? still not sure about the eye texture to be honest. I cant put my finger on why buy it doesn't quite fit in my eyes. Other than that she/he looks great. Do you have a scene in mind? I imagine the beasty grazing on a open plain perhaps with a couple of alien hunters stalking it?
Oh, this is still the exact same eye...I just toned it down a little and made it brown. Havn't started on the new eye yet... :o
And one of the things that you've might have noticed is that He/She is using black eyeliner...like Johnny Depp in Pirates of the Caribbean ;)
( It's also on my "Silly mistakes to fix"-list )
Ah..a scene...I'm not sure yet. I would like to match it with a photo of some nature, but it depends on how real I can make it look.
Not going to place myself on the back of it though (like you will on your Mech ;) ) |
Post by Shike // Jun 25, 2006, 5:20am
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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Ops, scratch reason 1: when I increased the material Autofacet angle to 80deg it looked smooth in both VRay and Player. :o
Here's the player version.
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Not posting the VRay one though, because I probably made some mistake and the normal mapping didn't show. But it looked veeery smooth ! ;) |
Post by brianalldridge // Jun 25, 2006, 5:25am
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brianalldridge
Total Posts: 397
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Not going to place myself on the back of it though (like you will on your Mech ;) )Then how about adding a saddle and a couple orks?:D |
Post by Shike // Jun 25, 2006, 6:12am
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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Then how about adding a saddle and a couple orks?:D
Ah..you're probably just joking...but it sounds soo tempting...would probably look cool...maybe not an orch...more like Gollum or the annoying little critter in Harry Potter...the sculpting would be fun :D ...but I would have to texture it :(
We'll see. ;) |
Post by brianalldridge // Jun 25, 2006, 10:43am
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brianalldridge
Total Posts: 397
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Ah..you're probably just joking...but it sounds soo tempting...would probably look cool...maybe not an orch...more like Gollum or the annoying little critter in Harry Potter...the sculpting would be fun :D ...but I would have to texture it :(
We'll see. ;) Bah, who needs textures, render it in black and white:p
Ps:I'm kidding btw about the textures |
Post by Shike // Jun 25, 2006, 12:03pm
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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Bah, who needs textures, render it in black and white:p
Ps:I'm kidding btw about the textures
Black and white you say...hm, I'll delete all the textures at once ;)
Yup, you triggered my insanity, now I've started on the driver. :D
The good thing about a driver is that I'll be forced to move the camera back a bit.... then the texturesize limit doesn't matter that much.
This is the simple concept sketch... I usually don't do much more which might be the reasons why I constantly hit the wall when it comes to texturing :rolleyes:
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I'm thinking primitive species...maybe just a loincloth and a rope that goes through the tribeast mouth.
And this is how far I've gotten with the base-polygon model.
Would probably have been faster if I know anything about bones.... now I modeled half, mirrored...and then moved the arm manually...:o
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Not 100% sure of the driver size...don't want to make it bigger...maybe smaller ?
I see this as a good way to test a different and probably better way to communicate with ZBrush.
FIRST create the base polygon model in tS in the correct scale and position, maybe even UVmap (nah, too lazy for that ;)) and then export to ZB for the highdensity sculpting and painting !
The way I created the TriBeast has only caused lots of problems :p |
Post by GraySho // Jun 25, 2006, 12:17pm
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GraySho
Total Posts: 695
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It's getting better and better, a rider, good idea. The rider should be a bit smaller, in no way bigger. You wouldn't ride your dog, would you ;) ? The texturework on the tribeast is excellent. Just try to darken the eyeball for a more animalistic look. |
Post by MadMouse // Jun 25, 2006, 12:37pm
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MadMouse
Total Posts: 1069
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Yes yes yes!!! You MUST do it! I demand it!!! :mad:
Sorry...... good idea I think it will look really good :D |
Post by Alien // Jun 25, 2006, 2:27pm
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Alien
Total Posts: 1231
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You wouldn't ride your dog, would you ;) ?
Funny you should mention that - my mum has a greyhound who's a bit bigger than your average greyhound, & several people [including me] have joked about her getting a saddle for him. :D |
Post by Shike // Jun 25, 2006, 10:16pm
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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It's getting better and better, a rider, good idea. The rider should be a bit smaller, in no way bigger. You wouldn't ride your dog, would you ? The texturework on the tribeast is excellent. Just try to darken the eyeball for a more animalistic look.
Thanks. Yes, a bit smaller would probably be best...although TriBeast is a bit bulkier than most dogs ;)
Eyeball - Yup, that will be fixed soon...
Yes yes yes!!! You MUST do it! I demand it!!!
Sorry...... good idea I think it will look really good
He,he...careful with your demands, I might demand that you actually model yourself for the Mech :D
Just joking ;) , I know that you're already pushing the memorylimit, while I so far only have 2 textured objects.... I should be able to put more into my scene without problem. :)
As long as I keep in mind that the loincloth and other props shouldn't be highres textured...since they, like the eye, would stand out as too different compared to the rest :rolleyes:
Funny you should mention that - my mum has a greyhound who's a bit bigger than your average greyhound, & several people [including me] have joked about her getting a saddle for him.
That would be a sight :D
Maybe not with a human on (since people would probably get upset) but a doll or something....think I've seen something like that on TV ?
Don't think I will do any saddle....the driver belong to a species that can't feel pain...and when this 3-legged critter starts bouncing around, there will be a lot of pain ;) |
Post by Alien // Jun 25, 2006, 11:28pm
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Alien
Total Posts: 1231
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That would be a sight :D
Maybe not with a human on (since people would probably get upset) but a doll or something....think I've seen something like that on TV ?
http://www.worth1000.com/entries/181500/181843AFiE_w.jpg
Admittedly that's a fake [from worth1000.com], but it's still funny. :)
Don't think I will do any saddle....the driver belong to a species that can't feel pain...and when this 3-legged critter starts bouncing around, there will be a lot of pain ;)
Maybe they can, but just happen to be partial to a bit of pain? http://homepage.ntlworld.com/alien42/smilies/naughty.gif
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/alien42/smilies/whipping.gif |
Post by W!ZARD // Jun 26, 2006, 2:14am
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W!ZARD
Total Posts: 2603
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Wow - I've been away a few days and I'm amazed at how much further your tribeast has come - great work Lars. I'm seriously liking the rider idea too. This is now one of my 'must watch' threads.
A thought about the tribeast eye - I'm wondering if the eye needs to be more forward looking. At the moment you have the iris (the coloured part of the eye - to save you looking it up!) positioned so the eye is looking sideways. Have you considered rotating the eye so the iris is more forward looking? Just a thought. Keep up the great work.:D |
Post by Shike // Jun 26, 2006, 3:10am
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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:D Maybe they can, but just happen to be partial to a bit of pain?
Nice :D
Maybe I should give the driver some black leather chaps or a gimp suit ;)
Wow - I've been away a few days and I'm amazed at how much further your tribeast has come - great work Lars. I'm seriously liking the rider idea too. This is now one of my 'must watch' threads.
Thanks ! :D
..starting to feel the pressure now...I better not mess up now ;)
Iris...must remember that :)
But the eye direction..I can aim the iris if that's what you meen, it was slightly foward looking in last render...
but changing the eye socket (geometry) to be more foward looking would be very hard now (1.8million polygons are not easily messed with ;)).
Grass-eaters like rhino, elephant, have rather sideways pointing eyes...but maybe not as much as TriBeast who is basically blind to everything in front of him/her ;)
( on my web-page I posted front-top-right-rear views of the beast that shows how little foward-view it actually has :o .)
BTW: The scar on the front lip is from the last time he/she walked straight into a tree ;) |
Post by Délé // Jun 26, 2006, 5:39am
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Délé
Total Posts: 1374
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Having a rider is a fantastic idea! Your sketches look great Shike. I can't wait to see him! :) |
Post by parva // Jun 26, 2006, 6:20am
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parva
Total Posts: 822
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I guess the Beast jumps right? :D Shouldn't the rider have something where he can hold his hands on? ...Or is the cylinder the thing which becomes the rein?
Looks great so far. |
Post by Shike // Jun 26, 2006, 10:49am
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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Having a rider is a fantastic idea! Your sketches look great Shike. I can't wait to see him! :)
Thanks, and no need to wait... ;)
I guess the Beast jumps right? Shouldn't the rider have something where he can hold his hands on? ...Or is the cylinder the thing which becomes the rein?
Thanks !
Considering that I'm skipping the saddle...I think jumping would be very bad for the driver...or maybe I should say jockey? ;)
Yup, the cylinder showed approximately what I had in mind: a piece of wood and the leather rein tied to it.
Ok, had to fix the trueSpace jockey a bit (made it smaller, thinner and redid the lifted arm) before exporting to ZBrush, but I had time to do a little sculpting:
( BTW: Nope the tribeast eyes are not yet fixed ;) )
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And don't worry, he will have fingers and toes when I'm finished. ;)
It's also possible that I will make his head bigger...looks too small
(hm, what's the point with concept sketches if I don't follow them :rolleyes: )
And a little bigger pic of just the jockey.
Edited away his hand/flipper since it looked too stupid :o
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The renders are like before, ts7, LightWorks HDRI.
Now it's time to sleep here in Sweden, and on wednesday I have to make a demo at a customer (needs preparation) but after that I'm back modelling :D |
Post by brianalldridge // Jun 26, 2006, 11:44am
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brianalldridge
Total Posts: 397
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Wow, you're fast! Nice/bad looking ork there, instead of balancing him on the beasts huge back, why not put him on its neck and have him grip it with his knees? |
Post by Shike // Jun 29, 2006, 3:28am
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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Wow, you're fast! Nice/bad looking ork there, instead of balancing him on the beasts huge back, why not put him on its neck and have him grip it with his knees?
Ah, well, fast has it's pitfalls sometimes ;)
I was back for modelling yesterday and discovered that there wasn't enough polygons around the hands and feets to make fingers and toes.... so I had to go back to tS7 and create that in the basepolygon shape...meaning, I'll have to start over in ZBrush :rolleyes:
One would think that I'd learned from my mistake with TriBeast...but noooo :o
(only created the head and torso for the basepolygon...and had a lot of problems adding the legs when I decided to make a full figure)
Gripping with knees..yeah that would be more like the pictures I've seen of elephant drivers and probably a better position if the tribeast moved fast.
But I kinda like the lazy relaxed look of the driver on the top.
So let's compromise: He sit's there now when the tribeast stands still, gives him a higher position for looking around...but when the tribeast starts bouncing around he has to take a tight grip around the neck to avoid falling off :D
( We'll have to wait and see what the tS7.5 animation and rigging can offer... if it's good, I might try to rig the beast and driver and position them differently.:D) |
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