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Harold's New Bike
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These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
Harold's New Bike // Work in Progress
Post by hemulin // Jul 11, 2006, 7:27am
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hemulin
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I think it will look fine, however you might want to consider making the front windscreen less transparent to make it look more cartoon like. |
Post by splinters // Jul 11, 2006, 7:31am
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splinters
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I think it will look fine, however you might want to consider making the front windscreen less transparent to make it look more cartoon like.
It is completely opaque and reflective-that is the lampost you see reflected in the windscreen...:confused:
I think it will look just fine too-I just needed reassurance that I wasn't being lazy...ain't too proud to use props...;) |
Post by Heidi // Jul 11, 2006, 8:40pm
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Heidi
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That little car looks very much in keeping with the style use in the other scenes. Just like something Harold might drive. :) |
Post by splinters // Jul 11, 2006, 8:48pm
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splinters
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Thanks Heidi, I really like it and can't see the point in modelling one from scratch just for the same results...:confused:
I will add a few features like personalised number plate and windscreen wipers, mirrors etc. to make it my own.
Blimey, three pics on the go at once now...:rolleyes: |
Post by splinters // Jul 12, 2006, 1:14am
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splinters
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Struggling with lighting on this one. Hard to really show the black leather without drenching the rest of the room. Any ideas?
Harold bought new leathers and some gloves and matching boots, and finally a helmet just to finish off his suit. And once he had his outfit right he knew the time had come, to take his nice new bike out for a long ride in the sun. |
Post by hemulin // Jul 12, 2006, 1:22am
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hemulin
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Struggling with lighting on this one. Hard to really show the black leather without drenching the rest of the room. Any ideas?
You could place a spotlight above him, and then model a ceiling mounted light. |
Post by brianalldridge // Jul 12, 2006, 9:31am
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brianalldridge
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One things I've noticed about the pics of him standing is that his arms always stick straight down, how about having him striking a pose in his new bike outfit? |
Post by MadMouse // Jul 12, 2006, 9:49am
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To be honest, I rather like the lighting the way it is. I like the oddly shaped door very much to.
The one thing that has been popping into my mind, and its difficult to say without sounding to disparaging, is that Harold tends to look a bit static. Its something that I've never really notice before but now that we are seeing more images in the sequence it starts to stand out and if viewed in book form could become, dare I say it, a bit dull. SORRY MATE :( Obviously there is the crashed scene and the wheelie but it might be worth considering varying the pose in forthcoming images to try and prevent this. I'm really sorry to drop this in your lap after all the hard work you've put into these fantastic images but surely its better to know now, rather than from a publisher!!!
Do you have poser Paul?????
EDIT: WOW thats a bit spooky.... while I was kocking up my image Brian spotted the same problem. |
Post by Steinie // Jul 12, 2006, 10:09am
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Steinie
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MadMouse ......and did you lift your Mech's leg like I asked?:confused:
No one (unless your in the Military) normally has all their weight on both legs, they normally shift it from one to the other. We're not aware of it but it's natural.
I had mentioned the same thing to Paul privately a while back. I think this is all positive criticism and meant to help you get published! |
Post by MadMouse // Jul 12, 2006, 10:19am
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MadMouse and did you lift your Mech's leg like I asked? Fair comment, and the answer is no not yet. But your comment was noted and in the next render it will be done.
I think this is all positive criticism and meant to help you get published! YES OF COURSE IT IS!!!!!! The last thing I would want to do is poo-poo Paul's work, and if that's how I came across then I sincerely apologise Paul. My intent was to help make fantastic renders even more fantastic. |
Post by splinters // Jul 12, 2006, 10:40am
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splinters
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Fair comments guys and please do not think that I have not considered this before but this is the rub;
1. To model Harold differently for each scene is a nightmare because I cannot do it with existing TS bones-that is why I am hoping TS7.5 will give them all a new lease of life.
2. Harold started off with a very peculiar shape and, as I thought it rather endearing, has kept that shape. I mean, hell, his bottom half is the bastard offspring of Humpty Dumpty...;) This makes posing him a little difficult-especially with those feet.
3. I did try some poses but because he is anatomically incorrect-I could only get his hand to reach to his groin-it looked a bit rude...:o
4. I actually quite like that montage Madmouse but I do see your point...but boring?
So my dilemma is; do I redesign Harold to make him more pose friendly or live with the rigid poses and keep his cute little character...I just don't know.
What I do know is I sorted out that last pic and it is half way through a 2/3 hour render but....his arms are in THAT pose.....:o :( :o
Now I am depressed... |
Post by Methusela // Jul 12, 2006, 11:17am
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I really like this alot. For the black leather dilemma, a dim backlight would solve that problem right?
As for the legs, that shouldn't be that difficult. I know the native TS bones are a pain, but they're quite useable (sp?). I suppose it depends on the polygon count. And the edge loops... >_< |
Post by MadMouse // Jul 12, 2006, 11:32am
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Now I am depressed... And now I feel like the bad guy :( :( :(
4. I actually quite like that montage Madmouse but I do see your point...but boring?
I never said Boring Paul. Dull was the word I used, maybe not the best choice of words (or I'm I digging myself deeper into this hole :( )
I don't think Harold needs totally redesigning. You've got bent legs in the wheelie scene and bent arms in the Doncaster scene so is it not possible to vary the positions in other scenes?? I don't think it needs a lot of variation just a touch here and there would do it.
I'm going to shut up now while people are still talking to me :(
At the end of the day you've still got some great renders here Paul.
P.S. SORRY:( |
Post by splinters // Jul 12, 2006, 11:50am
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Don't be sorry Madmouse-I was so wrapped up with compostion and lighting that I forgot the little nuances that give character. Several TS users have said that this thread is a learning experience for them and I am no different. At least we got it now before it is too late. I only have four 'finished' renders here;
1. The shop window-arms are fine here.
2. Paying by cheque-no problems
3. Crashed into shed-sat on bum so no problem
4. Emerging from shed-this will need a re-render maybe.
As for all the others-they can easily be tweaked and I have some bendy arms now...:banana: |
Post by hemulin // Jul 12, 2006, 11:59am
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now...:banana:
Well done....:jumpy: |
Post by TomG // Jul 12, 2006, 12:00pm
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One thing about the arms being in a "similar" pose - I actually quite like this effect.
The renders do not look like renders to me, so much as models. Maybe plasticine, maybe cloth and wool. Kind of Aardman animation like. Or maybe like Trumpton and Camberwick Green.
Those were all done with models, and to varying degrees, were limited by the physical constraints of the models. Thing is, I LIKE this look, as it gets away from the regular shiny CG look :)
It always looks like Paul has set up a little scene with models and photographed it. When I picture the animation between scenes (and like others have commented, that happens, the brain can't help but imagine it), I always imagine an older, stop-motion look, where the feet just slide along the ground, and the arms just raise up with no elbow joint bends, and so on.
To me it is part of the appeal, and is something kind of positive! So maybe a little bit more variety, but I don't think it would take too much.
Anyway, that's just my take on it. Who knows what a publisher might say - I suspect each publisher would say differently, just like so many of us here say differently, different tastes and all that.
This is fantastic work, and I know everyone agrees with that - every suggested change is just a change, and not a criticism, I don't think there is one person here who dislikes the renders :)
Thanks for sharing BTW Paul - looking forward to seeing more of Harold as time goes by.
Oh, and yes, I wouldn't be too keen on trying to add and use bones from the existing system either, I always found them to be something of a headache... now the next system, aha, well... maybe we will even see Harold in action in his own short, who knows! And that's short, as in short movie, not shorts, as in an item of clothing - though that could be a holiday snap I guess...
Tom |
Post by splinters // Jul 12, 2006, 12:18pm
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All comments are very welcome but I must admit, Tom has hit the nail on the head; I even add DOF to give the impression that they are little models being filmed closeup.
Having said that, I have taken the advice and posed Harold but you often wonder what to do with the arms-much like humans when waiting and being watched, never know what to do with their arms. Inspiration struck and I gave him the keys to his bike to hold. This certainly works better...time to tweak the other pending renders (a little) now...:rolleyes:
I really like your little montage, Madmouse-regardless of the 'pose' problem-it reminds me that I have managed to get a different feel/style to each image...
P.S Excuse small render-book on table is called 'HOW TO RIDE MOTOR BIKES' by Penny Farthing...ho..ho..ho |
Post by Shike // Jul 12, 2006, 12:35pm
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Shike
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Can't understand how you come up with all these environments....and all the props ! Impressive ! :D
The DOF looks perfekt ! |
Post by brianalldridge // Jul 12, 2006, 12:41pm
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brianalldridge
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And now I feel like the bad guy :(
I don't, I was gone while I was:p I definately like it better with the keys btw |
Post by splinters // Jul 12, 2006, 12:47pm
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splinters
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Can't understand how you come up with all these environments....and all the props ! Impressive ! :D
The DOF looks perfekt !
I raided my own archives-check out the ipak/TS for illustrators tutorial...:rolleyes:
http://www.caligari.com/Products/trueSpace/ts5/Plugins/Caligari/ipak/default.asp?Cate=Caligari
Still, like the Ducati, what else am I going to use them for...;) |
Post by MadMouse // Jul 12, 2006, 12:54pm
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MadMouse
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Phew I can come out of hiding now. I was going to ask Roman if the proteam came with a witness relocation scheme.:D
The new render is great Paul and Tom has hit the nail RIGHT on the head your renders do have a 'photographed model' look to them. I never looked at them in this way before but he's spot on. Move over Aardman here comes Woodward!!!:D
ATB
Steve |
Post by splinters // Jul 12, 2006, 1:08pm
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splinters
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Phew, 3000 view on this post.
Anyways, did the same on the shed render-better?
It is cropped by the way... |
Post by Steinie // Jul 12, 2006, 1:09pm
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Steinie
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MadMouse, I wasn't mad at you at all and your comments helped Paul's last render. The leg lift comment was suppose to be tongue in cheek and my comment about weight on one leg was suppose to be directed towards Splinters.
By shifting weight to one leg your hips will tilt, your shoulders will tilt in opposite direction creating a casual look and not a stiff one. All for the better. |
Post by splinters // Jul 12, 2006, 1:19pm
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splinters
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Who knows what a publisher might say - I suspect each publisher would say differently, just like so many of us here say differently, different tastes and all that. Tom
I know what they might say Tom, unfortunately it is thus far always NO THANKS!...:o |
Post by splinters // Jul 12, 2006, 1:42pm
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splinters
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And another update.....getting there now, although I might try Harold in jeans and trainers...:p |
Post by Alien // Jul 12, 2006, 5:44pm
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Alien
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All this talk of putting Harold in different poses got me thinking....
Remember the leather
Even in hot weather,
When you're ridin' a bike, ridin' a bike.
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/alien42/images_for_caligari_forum/saturdaynightharold.jpg
I was going to do his right [viewer's left] leg as well, but it would have taken way longer to do than his arms did. :) |
Post by hemulin // Jul 12, 2006, 10:28pm
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hemulin
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Alien I think you are getting a bit over unthusiastic. However Splinters, I think that adding different poses has really added more personality and character to the images, the make them more real. |
Post by TheWickedWitchOfTheWeb // Jul 13, 2006, 1:30am
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TheWickedWitchOfTheWeb
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I think the re-posed shed pic is great, it even looks more 'alien'. As for the 'leathers' pic, I imagine Harold is feeling supremely chuffed so how about hands on hips? (In a 'check me out' fashion, not a camp mincing one!) |
Post by Steinie // Jul 13, 2006, 1:46am
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Steinie
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If you take away the words to the story and just look at the pictures and poses, does it tell the same story? The hands on the hips standing at the doorway is a perfect example of "look at me" pose. Maybe a superman pose with legs slightly apart and hands on hips too, "I'm ready to ride" pose. |
Post by splinters // Jul 13, 2006, 1:52am
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splinters
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I think this one does; Harold gets a new matching outfit and is ready to take his bike outside out for a ride...image says all this.
I am afraid I may have to avoid potentially camp poses here...:rolleyes:
Besides, this one has been rendering for nearly two hours and I am NOT doing it again today...;)
One a more positive note-I am reposing other scenes and the Alien/shed pic looks better too...:jumpy: |
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