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Link to the manual?
About Truespace Archives
These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
Link to the manual? // Roundtable
Post by splinters // May 12, 2007, 11:28pm
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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This might be controversial but why not allow registered tS owners, of any version, to download the tS7/7.5 manual even if they have not purchased tS7.5?
It is of no use to anyone without the program and there may be many potential owners of 7.5 put off by its apparent 'complexity' where a quick look through the manual might just be what is needed to make that purchase.
Many other software houses let you download manuals and support material and it has certainly influenced my purchases in the past. I also remember looking at in depth reviews of games in magazines when I was younger before making a purchase.
You could never get as much explanation of the new features in your web pages or in this forum as the manaual would give, and how many questions around here are from people who either do not have the manual yet or are too busy playing with 7.5 to read it? ;)
Just my thoughts on this. |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 12, 2007, 11:32pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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I wouldn't just limit it to registered users, unless bandwidth became a problem.
Personally I think that making the manual freely available on the website is very useful to potential customers.
-Jack. |
Post by splinters // May 12, 2007, 11:34pm
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Bandwith is the only reason I suggested 'registered' users. It is free to register here and would stop mass 'leeching' of it...:) |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 12, 2007, 11:59pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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Also it might discourage piracy if people had to register to DL the manual and with the manual continually updated and training vids and such, a person would want access to the online version.
-Jack. |
Post by xmanflash // May 13, 2007, 3:03am
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xmanflash
Total Posts: 335
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...why not allow registered tS owners, of any version, to download the tS7/7.5 manual even if they have not purchased tS7.5?...
Excellent idea.. I think they should go one further, and create a free 'LITE' version of TS7.5 Just strip out some of the more complex features and vRay compatability... Lets make this the most popular software out there! Both Max and Maya have learning versions (Gmax and Maya PE) |
Post by nowherebrain // May 13, 2007, 3:40am
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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One problem is piracy, I don't really think Caligari has the problem that Autodesk has...(More honest users)but it does prevent people that have a pirated version from really using it....A good piece of demo software would be good though like a learning edition. This may also lead to piracy though. |
Post by Methusela // May 13, 2007, 9:55am
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Methusela
Total Posts: 414
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All seems to be well with 7.5 so far on the pirating market...
I was curious, so I did a cursory search over the web, including some of the more popular torrent networks and found pirated copies of TS7 and 6.6, but no 7.11 or 7.5. That's good at least. Shame about those others. :/ |
Post by Methusela // May 13, 2007, 10:05am
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Methusela
Total Posts: 414
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Ah, I spoke too soon. A google search revealed that it's already up on some Warez site. Now, whether or not it's actually TrueSpace 7.5 there's no way of knowing. But if it is, someone sucks really bad. |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 13, 2007, 2:04pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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Well the absence of it on the warez sites might indicate a lack of interest. So it's not all bad. Also sometimes pirates can be turned into paying customers if they get used to the product and need it for a commercial project.
Of course if it's out that fast then likely someone is distributing it with their serial number and Caligari can download it and run a check on the serial.
Pretty sad that someone would pay all that money to support Caligari and their product then turn around and stab them in the back and undermine sales though.
Maybe once most of the bug fixes and features that didn't make the 7.5 release are in place, Caligari can put out some kind demo or light version. :rolleyes:
-Jack. |
Post by bg01 // May 13, 2007, 2:24pm
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bg01
Total Posts: 7
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having browsed the manual (7.5), I don't think it will be of much help (unfortunately)
:( |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 13, 2007, 2:44pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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The online manual should be much more useful.
It'd be even cooler if it has collaborative features sort of like a Wiki page. Where users can post comments, additional tutorials, and clarifications.
-Jack. |
Post by nowherebrain // May 14, 2007, 2:26pm
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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Nah, I don't like the thought of being forcibly connected to the internet to use something....and Pirates are POOPY HEADS(I'd swear, if it weren't for the possibility of Norm 86'ing me!);) |
Post by DigitalSoapbox // May 14, 2007, 3:30pm
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DigitalSoapbox
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Nah, I don't like the thought of being forcibly connected to the internet to use something....and Pirates are POOPY HEADS(I'd swear, if it weren't for the possibility of Norm 86'ing me!);)
Adobe already does this and has done so for awhile now, as did Macromedia even before combining with Adobe. So, it's possible to do it online without worrying about poopy-headed pirates...
...what good would the manual be to them without the program anyway? And if they already pirated the program, it's not like they haven't already pirated the manual as well, if it's available in an electronic format. Either way, there's no point in worrying about it when the real concern is the pirated software itself, not its documentation. |
Post by nowherebrain // May 19, 2007, 10:19am
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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having browsed the manual (7.5), I don't think it will be of much help (unfortunately)
:(
Ha Ha!, currently yes, but there will be a newer one eventually. about the same time as the demo goes out I imagene...I think that Roman made a judgement call when he released it to us with a nearly incomplete manual...but I appreciate his decision...I am also glad that tS does not require a dongle(hardware lock) or online validation to use... |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 19, 2007, 11:32am
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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Dongles and online activation make me mad. :mad: You pay them $3000 and they hardware lock your software???? Even more annoying is the $400 Autocad expiring one year license...WTF?
Yeah that kinda of anti-piracy stuff only hurts real customers. Heck I've downloaded cracks just to use games I own because my CDs get scratched. :mad: :mad: Besides the fact that it's a pain to have to hunt for the CD everytime you want to use the app... :rolleyes: ;)
I'm very glad that Caligari doesn't put us through that kinda crap. :banana:
-Jack. |
Post by EyeInStein // May 19, 2007, 2:53pm
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EyeInStein
Total Posts: 38
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Maybe I'm offering too much info, but I've been there and done that. It was a pirated version of 6.6 that helped me decide to buy it and go legit. It is very gratifying to know that anything I make can (now) be used without fear.
Having pirated before - I know the scene... and even though a demo will be nice for everyone to try it out - I can't see it being too long before the demo limits are hacked. Even dongles and activations can be bypassed. I would hope that the programmers understand this and will cripple the demo enough - and not give away so much that bypassing the demo's limits gives them a full featured program.
Anyway, back to the thread's subject. I would like to see the manual made public - but would prefer to have a wiki format. Forums are great, but an organized wiki with walkthroughs and such - that would rock. |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 19, 2007, 3:21pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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That's a good point EyesInStein. Using pirated software to do professional work is taking a pretty big risk since it's fairly easy for the company to check and see if the person has a license should that person publish or sell their work in any way.
I completely agree with you about the Wiki, or even just creating forum sections for commenting and support on each chapter of the manual...
-Jack. |
Post by transient // May 19, 2007, 4:50pm
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transient
Total Posts: 977
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I would like to see the manual made public - but would prefer to have a wiki format. Forums are great, but an organized wiki with walkthroughs and such - that would rock.
I agree. In the short time 7.5 has been out there have been many valuable tips and workarounds discussed here. If this info was transferred to a wiki in the form of a quick intro guide it would definitely be a worthwhile thing to do.
Even if just the dev's and beta testers/gurus posts were compiled into an faq it would be a great start.
I would be more than happy to contribute to this if it was established, but I know nothing of making wiki's from scratch. |
Post by Délé // May 19, 2007, 5:00pm
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Délé
Total Posts: 1374
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Perhaps Norm could put up a sticky "Tips and Workarounds" thread where people could post little tips and workarounds to common issues. I don't know how exactly it could be controlled as you wouldn't want people posting responses in there to keep it a quick reference. Perhaps they could message tips to Norm and he could post them? Or that might be too much on Norm. Perhaps we could just post and Norm could sticky them when he gets a chance? Could something like that be set up someway? |
Post by spacekdet // May 19, 2007, 5:07pm
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spacekdet
Total Posts: 1360
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Knock yourself out! Post em if you got em.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TrueSpace
Mattam had a tS tips wiki started at one point in the past, but it sort of withered on the vine. Maybe by using the grand-daddy of wiki sites the results will be different. |
Post by nowherebrain // May 19, 2007, 6:43pm
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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I don't like being forced to be online for anything. I use the internet true, but my "work" computer I keep off the net. Not so much for safety, but the lack of options. Requiring a connection does limit people. I was in Iraq for 3 of the last 4 years(ARMY)and having software that required me to use the internet killed me. Now I don't have the internet. I use my parents("Dork!"). If I did have the internet I would feel exactly the same. |
Post by transient // May 19, 2007, 6:56pm
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transient
Total Posts: 977
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I don't think having a wiki would force anyone to do anything. It would be there for people who want it. Your never going to keep everyone happy, but the reality is we live in an online world now.
You could always download the wiki on to a usb drive and take it with you to your work computer. Maybe making this easier for people could be a priority. |
Post by Methusela // May 19, 2007, 10:53pm
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Methusela
Total Posts: 414
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Yeah that kinda of anti-piracy stuff only hurts real customers. Heck I've downloaded cracks just to use games I own because my CDs get scratched. :mad: :mad: Besides the fact that it's a pain to have to hunt for the CD everytime you want to use the app... :rolleyes: ;)
I'm very glad that Caligari doesn't put us through that kinda crap. :banana:
-Jack.
Ha! I've done that too! My Knights of the Old Republic (fantastic game) CD 3 broke. I panicked for all of twenty minutes until the pirated .iso had finished downloading. It was then simple to mount CD 3 and use the actual CDs for the rest! I feel like Elisabeth Swan. Saved by a pirate. XD
Except then I remember that the person who uploaded it probably punches little kids and barbeques bunnies for sport. |
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