|
|
Vray 1.5 vs 1.0
About Truespace Archives
These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
Vray 1.5 vs 1.0 // Archive: Tech Forum
Post by prodigy // May 12, 2007, 7:54pm
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
Hi,
Searching why Vray 1.5 is more slower than the 1.0 i found this particular thing..
5936
Using the same template "MEDIUM" you can see in blue these settings are not equal.. like upside down...
I think WOW, maybe this are the problem.. i change but nop.. its ok..
The quesiton is.. this is a 1.0 bug? or a 1.5? :confused:
Dont know if Bug or what ever you want to call, but one of these settings are wrong.. :D |
Post by prodigy // May 12, 2007, 7:58pm
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
And by the way... The intensity on 1.5 works??? i do not see any change with this value :confused: |
Post by Cthulhu // May 12, 2007, 8:13pm
|
Cthulhu
Total Posts: 48
|
Hi Prodigy. Not sure if this is why people are seeing a slowdown in Vray, but I noticed that multithreading in tS7.5 is off by default. In tS7 it was on by default. If you have a multi-core/processor computer, turn on multithreading to use all the processors (right-click the render button until the "PhotoRender" panel comes up, and select "Multithread" from there. I noticed this when I switched from my laptop (single processor) to my desktop (dual-core).
EDIT: Also, I noticed if you are rendering a view that has OpenGL as the real-time renderer, it will render really, really slow. |
Post by mrbones // May 12, 2007, 8:15pm
|
mrbones
Total Posts: 1280
|
VRay Environment Settings
1. Benefits
By specifying an environment image, you can tell Vray to calculate lighting and reflections from your environment image as well as from scene geometry and lights. The new Workspace settings increase the level of control previously available for environments.
The Environment Settings can be found under the GI aspect of the Vray panel
you may drag an image into this box, or Ctrl-double-click to bring up a file dialog. It is suggested that you use .HDR files for your environments. When you wish to clear the environment image and use just the Color, right-click the Image box and choose “Reset”
Format – there are several common formats for HDR environment maps, and you should make sure you set this to match your image, as “Auto-Detect” can not always give the correct results
Intensity – this controls the brightness of the global lighting generated from the image. If this is 0, no global illumination will be calculated.
Rfl Intensity – this separate control allows you to brighten or darken any reflections generated from the image. It also controls the brightness of the environment visible in the background – set this to 0 if you wish to disable environmental reflections
Samples – a higher value will result in more accurate lighting at the expense of render time. If you set this to 0, no global illumination will be calculated
Angle – modify this value to change the angle at which lighting is calculated
Saturation – allows you to modify how saturated the image is, from -1 to 1, with 0 being normal saturation and 0 being completely desaturated (grayscale)
Show bkground. – when enabled, the environment image will be visible in the background of the scene whenever there is no geometry
Env. Lighting only – when you are calculating lighting from the environment image, you usually want any actual lights in your scene to be disabled. This parameter controls that behaviour.
When environment lighting is enabled (Intensity and Samples both greater than 0), Vray will automatically do a global illumination pass, regardless of whether you have GI enabled or not. If you do not have it enabled, Vray will use GI settings optimized for HDRI lighting, so if you need a more complete GI solution, make sure you enable the regular GI checkbox
Information provided by Simon Windmill,
HTH |
Post by mrbones // May 12, 2007, 8:19pm
|
mrbones
Total Posts: 1280
|
true observation, make sure it is set to direct-X and not OpenGL
EDIT: Also, I noticed if you are rendering a view that has OpenGL as the real-time renderer, it will render really, really slow. |
Post by prodigy // May 12, 2007, 8:31pm
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
Thanks guys for the info..
But i know about the bad performance on openGL and i have enabled the multithread as well..;)
I work for a long time with Vray1.0 and im sure are something wrong on vray.. i cant imagine with the same settings go from 1 minute to 2...
Thats not good.. I allways said its impresive the speed of Vray and now i think is more slower than lightworks?? mmm not good. :( |
Post by mrbones // May 12, 2007, 8:38pm
|
mrbones
Total Posts: 1280
|
Prodigy,
Did you get the manual for Vray 1.5??
Global Illumination gives a similar kind of result as radiosity in other render engines supported by trueSpace (another mathematical model for calculating how light bounces around in a scene, not supported under V-Ray as Global Illumination replaces it), but Global Illumination under V-Ray is generally faster to render, and gives better quality results.
Basic parameters for Global Illumination can be set in the Default aspect of the control panel, but below we will look at the detailed parameters which are available in the GI aspect of the control panel.
I notice your settings are differnt than default supplied, you have 0 samples for example.... |
Post by prodigy // May 12, 2007, 8:44pm
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
Yes i know TB,:)
But you work with 1.0?? is much much faster than 1.5 thats the point..
I know 1.5 has more features.. but has is much slower than 1.0 you may try.. ;)
I think the problem is are many new 1.5 Vray users.. and not to much 1.0 users.. so few users can compare from the older one.
But is a fact... the same scene, same settings on the same machine are a visible diference between both versions.. |
Post by mrbones // May 12, 2007, 8:45pm
|
mrbones
Total Posts: 1280
|
Yes, but your settings appear different from default Vray1.5.
Vray 1.5 is different than 1.0 in the way it handles renderings so your test will not show correct, I think.
I do agree 1.5 should indeed be faster and not slower.
I have seen a video by Simon Windmill that explains how to make renders faster than 1.0 but I can not seem to find it.
Maybee Roman or Norm can post it here..
Cheers
Yes i know TB,:)
But you work with 1.0?? is much much faster than 1.5 thats the point..
I know 1.5 has more features.. but has is much slower than 1.0 you may try.. ;)
I think the problem is are many new 1.5 Vray users.. and not to much 1.0 users.. so nobody cant compare from the older one.
But is a fact... the same scene, same settings on the same machine are a visible diference between both versions.. |
Post by prodigy // May 12, 2007, 8:48pm
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
Ok thanks...:)
I think i know what video you are talking about... Simon showing the new material editor, and the area light falloff... and other good stuffs... im try to find tomorrow.. now 3:50 am.. So TrueBone... seeya tomorrow..
Btw, good work with 7.5 |
Post by trueBlue // May 12, 2007, 9:40pm
|
trueBlue
Total Posts: 1761
|
Here is the same benchmark scene with the updated 7.5 PhotoRender and Vray panels.
I transferred to old benchmark scene settings to the new panels. PhotoRender and Vray panels were changed in tS7.5 as well as default settings.
Test again with this scene and see if there is any difference with Vray 1.5 |
Post by parva // May 12, 2007, 11:45pm
|
parva
Total Posts: 822
|
Indeed min rate/ max rate values are reversed (tsv1.0 is right here) but I guess it's an error done with placing the text parts not an error in settings itself (that happens quite easy, at least it happens me too by organizing work in panels) there I see no problems here.
No problems with intensity values.
But you will encounter (if you haven't yet) that prefiltering can't be disabled. |
Post by xmanflash // May 13, 2007, 2:46am
|
xmanflash
Total Posts: 335
|
Here is the same benchmark scene with the updated 7.5 PhotoRender and Vray panels.
I transferred to old benchmark scene settings to the new panels. PhotoRender and Vray panels were changed in tS7.5 as well as default settings.
Test again with this scene and see if there is any difference with Vray 1.5
I get an error popup on loading this file (TS 7.5, Vray 1.5):
Load Object: Invalid Version: 22048
...even though the .scn extracted from the zip file ok.. |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 13, 2007, 4:47am
|
Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
|
You have to load .scn files from Model side. Double clicking on them doesn't seem to work.
-Jack. |
Post by prodigy // May 13, 2007, 5:26am
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
Indeed min rate/ max rate values are reversed (tsv1.0 is right here) but I guess it's an error done with placing the text parts not an error in settings itself (that happens quite easy, at least it happens me too by organizing work in panels) there I see no problems here.
No problems with intensity values.
But you will encounter (if you haven't yet) that prefiltering can't be disabled.
Yup, i think the error is not placing the text, (thats the simple way) :) the correction must be placing the values.. So Vray 1.0 and 1.5 looks equals.. no changes on the positions is a better UI ;) |
Post by xmanflash // May 13, 2007, 5:56am
|
xmanflash
Total Posts: 335
|
You have to load .scn files from Model side. Double clicking on them doesn't seem to work.
-Jack.
Ahh - OK thanks - I'll try that as soon as I can get TS to work again - It loads and then tells me there is an image missing (that has a weird filename), and then crashes to a MS debug error that points to txapi.dll
AppName: ts7.exe AppVer: 7.5.0.1 ModName: tsxapi.dll
ModVer: 7.5.0.1 Offset: 0003c1a9
Sigh.. |
Post by prodigy // May 13, 2007, 6:01am
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
Ok i fix an error, i wrote 3 minutes 34 seconds for the "old" benchmark and it was 2 minutes 34 seconds (sorry too tired :rolleyes:)
On the "new" benchmark it was 2 minutes 28 seconds..
I made again the benchmark with 7.11 Vray 1.0 and yup.. 1 minute 6 seconds..
Double on time..
*But please do this test at home...;) |
Post by parva // May 13, 2007, 6:58am
|
parva
Total Posts: 822
|
Have done just a short test in 7.5, have deinstalled 7.1 so can't test there.
1:17 min at modeler
1:14 min at workspace (probably due to manual time recording :D and/or manual camera focus there workspace camera-render window allows nearly no accurate frame setting and is totally different to modeler)
no aa, 640x480px... but the bench scene isn't quite good for vray. It uses none of the vray shaders, no gi, no caustics etc. so that tells us nothing about changes and speed.
We need a vray-only bench scene for this. |
Post by prodigy // May 13, 2007, 11:00am
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
The test must be at 1000x1000px with antialiasing, without globla illumination without nothing..
and if you dont use 7.11 vray 1.0 you cant compare.;)
And parva.. 1 minute 30 seconds is a big diference... so i think this is not a minor problem.. is not a wrong icon.. its a very very very decay on the vray speed.. so dont just say "that tells us nothing about changes and speed." if i say 1.5 on the same scene is 1 minute 30 seconds later, is a BIG diference im not talking about 4 5 seconds.. are 90 seconds..
That multiplicate on a animation?? you must multiplicate x2 and if you make a 3 days render that became on a week.. its a HUGE problem at my point of view.. |
Post by blakeo // May 13, 2007, 11:50am
|
blakeo
Total Posts: 214
|
Hi - I've just been trying this and I confirm that 1.5 seems a lot slower than 1.0.
I made a very simple scene with few cubes and turned off all GI, etc. As far as I can tell I set all settings equal between 1.0 and 1.5.
In 7.11 with VRay 1.0 renders about 3 seconds
in 7.5 with VRay 1.5 renders about 6 seconds (both ws and model)
at 640x480
Hmmm.... |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 13, 2007, 2:17pm
|
Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
|
My experience has been the same, it takes about twice as long.
-Jack. |
Post by prodigy // May 13, 2007, 2:26pm
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
Thanks Blakeo And Jack.. im not alone in the world :D |
Post by noko // May 13, 2007, 4:28pm
|
noko
Total Posts: 684
|
Is this just without GI, Caustics or does the same pattern show when other features are used? How about soft shadows, transparent shadows? Maybe faster? |
Post by prodigy // May 13, 2007, 4:31pm
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
Not test yet.. but i do in a few hours when i finish a presentation.. |
Post by Cthulhu // May 13, 2007, 5:03pm
|
Cthulhu
Total Posts: 48
|
It seems Vray 1.5 isn't so good with raytracing either. I've tried the following scene with a couple different scenarios, and Vray 1.5 is consistently about twice as slow as Vray 1.0. Though, 1.5 renders a more accurate image (the anti-aliasing on the back seam between the wall and the floor, and the reflections on the floor).
Attachment: 5974
The scene has GI on, with Vray Fresnel (for the yellow glass) and Glossy (for the floor). I also tested just raytracing (no GI), and raytracing with all-plain materials (white, diffuse reflectance). The times are guestimates (ie: me counting by 1000's):
GI: ~10 seconds/~26seconds (1.0/1.5) (image below)
Raytracing (w/ materials): ~3 seconds/~6 seconds (1.0/1.5)
Raytracing (white objects): ~1seconds/~2seconds (1.0/1.5)
It's hard to tell without cranking up the levels in a paint program, but the 1.5 render on the right is correctly rendering reflections on the black checkers of the floor:
5975
(Sorry for the JPEG artifacting. I think my picture got re-compressed/converted when I uploaded) |
Post by nowherebrain // May 13, 2007, 5:30pm
|
nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
|
This is all so odd..I swear it actually renders nearly 25% faster on my machine??? This could just be a fluke...with my machine??(shrug) |
Post by prodigy // May 13, 2007, 5:40pm
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
tell us what do you have.. maybe are a problem with hyperthreading.. or something..
I have a P4 Ht 3.0ghz ~ 1g dual channel ~ 256mb 6600 Nvidia chipset ~ Xp Sp2 Pro. |
Post by Cthulhu // May 13, 2007, 6:27pm
|
Cthulhu
Total Posts: 48
|
I just tried the scene posted above on my laptop (with GI):
tS7.11 w/ Vray 1.0: ~26 seconds
tS7.5 w/ Vray 1.5: ~67 seconds
Laptop: 2.66GHz Pentium 4 (no multithreading), 1GB RAM, Windows XP Home (32 Bit)
Desktop (used in original test posted above) 2.4GHz AMD X2 dual-core (multithreading used), 2GB RAM, Windows XP Professional (32-bit)
So, on two different computers, I'm getting the same trend. Vray 1.5 is around twice as slow as Vray 1.0. |
Post by prodigy // May 13, 2007, 6:36pm
|
prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
|
Thanks! for the info... |
Post by parva // May 13, 2007, 10:50pm
|
parva
Total Posts: 822
|
OK I tried it on my old laptop where 7.1 is still installed (don't know why :D).
v1 - 3:37 min
v1.5 - 4:55 min
But even if you render a blank empty scene the buckets move much slowlier in v1.5 so I confirm prodigy. Something slows down enormous which of course is much more visible if you render to higher resolution.
edit: oh and I just see. Subdiv and Light Samples text is also reversed for Lightcache. |
|
