|
|
Airship
About Truespace Archives
These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
Airship // Work in Progress
Post by Momaw // Dec 8, 2007, 5:33am
|
Momaw
Total Posts: 21
|
http://momaw.kikaimegami.com/airship1-1-1_thumb.jpg
Greatly enlarged version (201kbytes) (http://momaw.kikaimegami.com/airship1-1-1.jpg)
This is intended to be a fast, armed air recon ship in a steampunk type of setting. It has a pair of swivelling steam-cannons to engage both ground and air targets. It has both sails and steam-powered props to move and turn so that it's not totally at the mercy of the wind. While this design has far too little lifting gas volume to actually fly in the real world, I tried for a visually pleasing balance of lift versus structure.
This is basically just a "sketch" at this point; the geomtry is primitive, I'm missing a lot of rigging, and the texturing/rendering should be considered entirely temporary. I'm looking for initial thoughts on the basic concept. I know there's a few folks on these forums who like airships. :) Not bad for 2 hours' work so far, imho. |
Post by jamesmc // Dec 8, 2007, 5:57am
|
jamesmc
Total Posts: 2566
|
Very Jules Verne like.
For purposes of display, if it were me, I would tend to exaggerate rigging and mechanical parts so they would bring attention to the parts itself.
I would give the airbag portion a menacing look, some sort of forward aggressive imagery.
And I would give the airship the look of massiveness by setting the scene is some sort of perspective. Like overwhelming in size of a battlefield or a land based object.
Great idea, I like it. :) |
Post by Momaw // Dec 9, 2007, 6:12pm
|
Momaw
Total Posts: 21
|
http://momaw.kikaimegami.com/airship1-2-1_thumb.jpg
Greatly enlarged verion (261kbytes) (http://momaw.kikaimegami.com/airship1-2-1.jpg)
Exaggerate the rigging? You mean make it larger than plausible? I know I'll need a whole hell of a lot of extra doodads, but I was thinking make it all the proper size. I really want this to feel like a machine you look at and think "I wonder when that was around?"... As much plausibility as possible.
Not sure how to make the shape any more forward-leaning without making it impractical. Sketch something?
As far as scene development, still much too early :P
I put in temporaryy people to show scale. The person on the catwalk is easy to see because they're sillouhetted. There's another in the ship, aft.
- added ribs
- smoothed main balloon
- added ballast tanks, ballast stays and rack, ballast release line
- catwalk, catwalk railing, ladder to get up there (shiver)
- elevator fins
- cleaned up front end of keels
- diagnal bracing along keels for rigidity
To-do:
- change to rudder instead of fan?
http://momaw.kikaimegami.com/airship1-2-2.png
- elevator controls
- smooth rear ballon and add ribs/fittings
- add misc fittings (attachment points, guides, blocks) to rigging
- sail rigging... Sail opens up or to side? To side seemingly makes more sense, but how would that look... Need to find good source for hi-resolutino sailing ship images |
Post by 3dfrog // Dec 10, 2007, 2:42am
|
3dfrog
Total Posts: 1225
|
That's a really nice looking airship. No criticisms from me, sounds like you got it under control. With some nice texturing it will look real slick. |
Post by Steinie // Dec 10, 2007, 7:35am
|
Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
|
I think the second rendering you posted shows the modeling much better. This will look great textured. You should hook up with Wizard who is another Airship designer. |
Post by spacekdet // Dec 10, 2007, 8:09am
|
spacekdet
Total Posts: 1360
|
I like the idea of the propeller functioning as a rudder. The sail-type rudder requires forward motion to function, whereas a prop allows the ship to hover and turn in place.
There's no reason why there couldn't be both- the sail-type rudder could be collapsed and stowed when executing low or no speed turns and deployed for steering on long stretches. |
Post by jamesmc // Dec 10, 2007, 12:57pm
|
jamesmc
Total Posts: 2566
|
Exaggerate the rigging? You mean make it larger than plausible? I know I'll need a whole hell of a lot of extra doodads, but I was thinking make it all the proper size. I really want this to feel like a machine you look at and think "I wonder when that was around?"... As much plausibility as possible.
Not sure how to make the shape any more forward-leaning without making it impractical. Sketch something?
Well, not that good of an artist, but here is a concept of a combat airship. Huge Gatling guns on the front. :D
I over sized some of the rigging to give it a menacing look. Like I said, not much of an artist, just a concept what I was thinking about. |
Post by Momaw // Dec 10, 2007, 5:28pm
|
Momaw
Total Posts: 21
|
http://momaw.kikaimegami.com/airship1-3-1.png
Played around with having both a fan and a rudder. It makes it look sort of "hacked together" :confused: I can appreciate the design sense of having both as pointed out by Spacekdet, just struggling to fit them both onto the frame in a pleasing way.
Worked on the sails a little too, and other various improvements. |
Post by W!ZARD // Dec 11, 2007, 4:25am
|
W!ZARD
Total Posts: 2603
|
Woo Hoo! Airships! I love 'em! Momaw, thanks for your email. I am truly looking forward to seeing how this progresses - I'm recalling the design sensibilities of your steam cannon and imagining that applied to the excellent pics you've already got - ooh I'm all excited!
Right! Some comments, as requested. I'll start at the back and work forward - first the rudder/propeller: maneuverability must be a major consideration, particularly for a warship suspended beneath the enticing target of several large airbags!! In fact the lack of maneuverability was one of the contributing factors that lead to the famous Hindenberg airship disaster - the captain tried to turn her too quickly which stretched and broke some internal support wires which in turn punctured the gas bag - add some static electrical discharge and .... well we all know what happened! Modern airships use ducted fans because they simply give the greatest focus of thrust - therefore I would suggest some sort of ducted fan - basically a propeller in a directable tube. As this is a modern design consept you could consider using Steam-pipe construction methods to suggest the historical veracity you are after.
Re the gas bags - you've said you are aware that they are not really big enough to support such a vessel (especially if it's steam powered which implies water to heat and combustible material to heat it - both are weighty commodities. Obviously proportion is a large part of the design aesthetics but if you look at pictures of real-world airships you will see that the gas bags are big - really big! I would recommend that you increase the size of your gasbags by at least a factor of 2 but otherwise retaining the scale of everything else - the top deck/walkway would need to be longer of course.
With my own airship pictures I often find it helps to have at least two vessels in the frame - one close up to show structural details/rigging and so forth to establish scale and another ship deeper in the background revealing the overall structural shape.
Re the sails - these could open much like a curtain but would need to look like they were reasonably adjustable. Any head wind will mean the sails act as air brakes. You could try mounting a vertical mast adjacent to the airbags with an adjustable boom sticking out to the side with a triangular sail such as would be found on a yacht - with a reversed version on the other side. Further mast/s could also extend upwards from the top deck/walkway.
Lastly - technically an airship comes in one of two basic forms; the blimp, where the gas bags shape is defined by the internal gas pressure and the dirigible, which has a rigid frame supporting and surrounding the gas bags (the Hindenberg was a dirigible).
Larger airships are usually dirigibles, with a skeletal frame surrounding and supporting the gas bladders and a lightweight fabric outer covering. One would expect to see some signs of the inner skeletal structure showing through the outer contours of such a gas bag. Even with a blimp design the way the envelope is stitched together means there are definite lines in the fabric. This is where you could take advantage of James excellent suggestion regarding the forward aggressive lines.
Of course the very best advice I can give is to completely ignore all I've said and follow your own creative instincts - from what I've seen of your other work you will do just brilliantly! |
Post by Momaw // Dec 11, 2007, 4:34pm
|
Momaw
Total Posts: 21
|
I didn't do any modelling today, just thought I'd drop an interesting fact I learned today: helium is approximately 1 kilogram per cubic meter lighter than "air" at 65F degrees and at an altitude of zero meters.
Further very rough approximations tell us that the existing primary gas bag has a volume of... (skip next paragraph)
9 meter diameter at greatest point * 27 meters long to practical ends of cylinder... 3.14159*4.5**2 = 63.62 square meters * 27 = 1,717.74 cubic meters, plus, a sphere to approximate rounded ends: 0.75 * 3.14159 (2.37) * 9**2 = 190.85 cubic meters; add together;
1908.59 cubic meters. Throw in the little balloon on the back and we'll say that the real-world lift potential of a gas volume that large is about two tons. Versus real-world history's actual airships with volumes ten times that and up.
End trivia. :) |
Post by jamesmc // Dec 11, 2007, 4:40pm
|
jamesmc
Total Posts: 2566
|
Nice statistics!
That's almost as impressive as the hot air in the 'gas bags' when have in Washington D.C. :D |
Post by W!ZARD // Dec 12, 2007, 8:50pm
|
W!ZARD
Total Posts: 2603
|
I didn't do any modelling today, just thought I'd drop an interesting fact I learned today: helium is approximately 1 kilogram per cubic meter lighter than "air" at 65F degrees and at an altitude of zero meters.
Further very rough approximations tell us that the existing primary gas bag has a volume of... (skip next paragraph)
9 meter diameter at greatest point * 27 meters long to practical ends of cylinder... 3.14159*4.5**2 = 63.62 square meters * 27 = 1,717.74 cubic meters, plus, a sphere to approximate rounded ends: 0.75 * 3.14159 (2.37) * 9**2 = 190.85 cubic meters; add together;
1908.59 cubic meters. Throw in the little balloon on the back and we'll say that the real-world lift potential of a gas volume that large is about two tons. Versus real-world history's actual airships with volumes ten times that and up.
End trivia. :)
There ya go! Airship modeling; addictive AND educational! |
|
