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TS7.5 Initial reactions
About Truespace Archives
These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
TS7.5 Initial reactions // New Users
Post by Jack Edwards // May 12, 2007, 8:24am
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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Bummer. Sorry Gord. :( Maybe they'll have time to work on customizable color themes now that the release is out :confused:
-Jack. |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 12, 2007, 8:40am
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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@jaywat
Can you post each of the problems you need help with in separate threads? You'll be able to get more specific help that way.
-Jack. |
Post by Improv // May 12, 2007, 8:40am
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Improv
Total Posts: 0
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Bummer. Sorry Gord. :( Maybe they'll have time to work on customizable color themes now that the release is out :confused:
-Jack.
It would have been nice to have a few colour scheme presets but also let the user choose custom colours for the gui. At the very least, they should have included a high contrast scheme for people that need it.
Personally, I love the neutral colours like the greys-they don't intrude or draw attention away from your work. But then I'm used to a neutral background from my digital recording software like Cubase, Logic, etc.. |
Post by stan // May 12, 2007, 8:43am
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stan
Total Posts: 1240
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Jack that would be great :) ..it's not like I have always seen this way..until 9 years ago I could see better than most. truespace became my only outlet for art and design because I could, until this version work with it easily..Gord :cool: |
Post by roman // May 12, 2007, 9:37am
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roman
Total Posts: 320
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Half the actions I try to perform while following the manual or a tutorial simply does not do what it says it will, thus stopping me dead in my tracks for following any further.
Some examples:
Loading bitmap to displacement brush? Says to do so by "double clicking on brush texture rectangle on displacement map panel." Doesn't work. Nothing happens whatsoever when you double click the texture rectangle. I still have no idea how to load a bitmap to the brush.(I must admit that manual is not as polished as we would want to have it, in some cases it still includes TS7.0 screen grabs. We are commited to release chapter updates regularly inlcuding promised video tutorials.
As for CTRL double click neccessary for loading textures, somehow developers changed double click to CTRL double click and it fell through cracks with no one noticing. This is an example of a quick fix we plan to do in a service upgrade to TS7.5. I think double click should be enough for now use CTRL double click. |
Post by splinters // May 12, 2007, 9:44am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Look on the bright side, if this was a printed manual (weighing quite a bit) you would need to return it and get a new one in a few weeks time. Some advantages to a digital format.
Seriously though, so much time was spent testing tS7.5 that the manual was left a little later than for 7.0. There really is no 'manual author', it is put together by Dev's, testers and Caligari staff (yes, I did my bit too-the quickguide). They did a great job in the time they had and many companies might just fob you off with a 'when we get chance to fix it' line.
Having worked with Roman and his team, when they say it will be addressed quick...I believe them...:D |
Post by kena // May 12, 2007, 5:59pm
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kena
Total Posts: 2321
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I would like to see a more complete manual myself... It seems to leave out critical steps here and there. It would appear to be written by people who know the program for people who know the program. I would like a version written for a 10 year old that does not leave these important things out. |
Post by xmanflash // May 13, 2007, 3:14am
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xmanflash
Total Posts: 335
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I would like to see a more complete manual myself... It seems to leave out critical steps here and there. It would appear to be written by people who know the program for people who know the program. I would like a version written for a 10 year old that does not leave these important things out.
Absolutely and again, definately this is needed. :) call it a 'not so quick' quick guide! |
Post by Andy_H // May 13, 2007, 7:49am
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Andy_H
Total Posts: 3
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My thoughts
As a totally new user it certainly looks a powerful program, I have to echo what’s been said about the workspace tool-tips, though I can fully understand that experienced users wouldn’t want tool-tips that intrude on the work area, maybe a 3 way switch like, no tips, normal, and enhanced to allow the tips, to be set for different users,
I’m having fun working out what to do with the manual, but as has been pointed out by others, many of the tutorials leave a lot for the user to find out by him/her self, which although can be frustrating, in one way it can also have a positive side, by forcing the user to go searching for things it can make it easier to remember in the long run, providing one hasn’t thrown the computer through the window in the meantime,
I like the workspace, not too keen on having to switch between model and workspace, I like the object navigation widget better in the workspace.
My Undo, although set to 20, only seems to undo once or twice, (undo is needed more when your a new user), I’m guessing that as well as recording the modelling in the undo list, it as also recording every mouse click and movement. Don’t know if there is a way to just set it just to keep a record of modelling.
But I’m well impressed by the program, and I will probably have some questions to ask when I get further into the manual.
Andy |
Post by maxd // May 13, 2007, 7:56am
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maxd
Total Posts: 28
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can somebody enlighten me as to why we need a model and workspace side...
if modelling iwth Ts7.5 tools is able to be performed in workspace.. why model...
please forgive my ignorance as a new user..., but i think wizard as also asked why we need 3 different render modes and thus have to learn 3 workflows for vray, lightworks and virtualight...
im a bit confused atm regards all 3...
ill keep at it.. tho the more i work the more questions i have..
:D |
Post by splinters // May 13, 2007, 8:13am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Model side is necessary until all features of earlier tS can be ported to workspace side. Without it you could not load .scn or .cob files, tsx's etc.
I am sure that one day it will little more than a nostalgic add-on but as a new user, you have absolutely no need to start in model side.
There are a few features in model that are not available in wS and unless you have Vray you still need model side to render from...:)
As for three different render engines-that is a good thing as each has it own strengths. |
Post by Délé // May 13, 2007, 8:20am
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Délé
Total Posts: 1374
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can somebody enlighten me as to why we need a model and workspace side...
if modelling iwth Ts7.5 tools is able to be performed in workspace.. why model...
please forgive my ignorance as a new user..., but i think wizard as also asked why we need 3 different render modes and thus have to learn 3 workflows for vray, lightworks and virtualight...
im a bit confused atm regards all 3...
ill keep at it.. tho the more i work the more questions i have..
trueSpace 7 started a whole new era. The program didn't just get a makeover, it is being completely re-written from the ground up (All new code). Caligari decided to combine the old and new architecture so that the user has a robust toolset as well as backward compatibility during the change. They can't re-write the entire trueSpace program in just one or two years. So this was arguably the best way to make a smooth transition during a complete re-write of the program.
So the model side is essentially version 6.6 (with some enhancements). It's sort of like one big plug-in that is attached to the new architecture. The Workspace is the new architecture where all of the new tools are getting written in. So eventually, when the new architecture has enough tools to stand on it's own, the model side will get cut off.
Right now it's kind of like a hybrid application. The new architecture and the old one share information via the bridge. That's why there is a model side (old) and Workspace side (new).
As for different rendering engines, that's just the way it's got to be I think. There are actually 4 different rendering engines you can use (Lightworks, Virtualight, Vray, and D3D realtime). They are four separate engines (not made by Caligari) that read information differently, thus they need different shaders written especially for them.
hth |
Post by roman // May 13, 2007, 9:30am
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roman
Total Posts: 320
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Well put Dele and Splinters. There are a lot of users who put a huge investment in learning TS6.6 UI, they like it and there are hundreds of tools available which can not be replicated instantly in new architecture. We must respect wishes of those users and keep bi-directional compatibility between TS6 model side and new workspace side. Over time all tools will move to workspace of course. |
Post by MadMouse // May 13, 2007, 9:34am
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MadMouse
Total Posts: 1069
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Over time all tools will move to workspace of course
And will that mean the death of the model side?? or will we still have the flexibility of having both together?? |
Post by PrimMac // May 13, 2007, 12:29pm
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PrimMac
Total Posts: 78
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Hi everyone,
Thanks for the tip on opening the Link Editor. I have never used it much, but I ocassionally like to open it and move the connectors around, see if anything happens (most of the time nothing does :)). It seems like a powerful tool, but it's so complex for me, so I've never had a use for it. I am content with being able to manipulate the figures directly on the workspace. |
Post by kena // May 14, 2007, 7:09pm
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kena
Total Posts: 2321
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I like to work primarily in the model side. I flip to the Workspace side sometimes for a preview, but not much else yet. As for the Link Editor, I'm not good with advanced stuff yet, but it is wonderful for arranging the list of objects without my having to write them on a piece of paper like I used to do. If you click and drag across several objects you can highlight them all, and even group them as siblings with a single click of an icon. This is the “encapsulate objects in 3D” button. I preferred it where it was in 7.11, but I can live with it now that I know where it is. It allowed me in my latest render to group all my stones together. And in the two figures, allowed me to group the individual pieces. So instead of having over 200 separate objects, I have only 11 grouped and single objects. Easier to manipulate and manage |
Post by Shike // May 14, 2007, 10:33pm
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Shike
Total Posts: 511
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And will that mean the death of the model side?? or will we still have the flexibility of having both together??
I think it's for the best if model-side goes bye-bye, would really force me to learn the new stuff ;)
For ts7.1 I played around a little with LE, new libraries, "Player"...then turned off the bridge and stayed in the tS6 lookalike environment where I felt comfy :p
Now I feel that there is a real point in learning the new stuff. Just being able to but bones in my characters and pose them...no more sculpting in final pose and then be stuck with that pose! :D
Might even try to animate things ! Havn't done that in many years ! :o
*wanders off, reading PDF, feeling like a newbie* ;) |
Post by weaveribm // May 14, 2007, 10:55pm
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weaveribm
Total Posts: 592
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...the “encapsulate objects in 3D” button. I preferred it where it was in 7.11, but I can live with it now that I know where it is. It allowed me in my latest render to group all my stones together. And in the two figures, allowed me to group the individual pieces. So instead of having over 200 separate objects, I have only 11 grouped and single objects. Easier to manipulate and manage.
That's very interesting kena thanks. Layers aren't supported in 7.5 I think but if these groups can be set to Locked or something similar could this be a way to have 7.11 layers please?
Peter |
Post by Norm // May 16, 2007, 5:52am
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Norm
Total Posts: 862
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And will that mean the death of the model side?? or will we still have the flexibility of having both together??
At that point in time the model side becomes redundant :) |
Post by mrbones // May 16, 2007, 9:37pm
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mrbones
Total Posts: 1280
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The model side is good for some things.
Vertex animation and particles, you can load the old KFE into the workspace side and run vertex or particles or other older animation scenes via bridge sync. So it is still like another animation dimension for the new Workspace.
can somebody enlighten me as to why we need a model and workspace side...
if modelling iwth Ts7.5 tools is able to be performed in workspace.. why model...
please forgive my ignorance as a new user..., but i think wizard as also asked why we need 3 different render modes and thus have to learn 3 workflows for vray, lightworks and virtualight...
im a bit confused atm regards all 3...
ill keep at it.. tho the more i work the more questions i have..
:D |
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