|
|
Problems with attaching meshes and Weld Elements
About Truespace Archives
These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
Problems with attaching meshes and Weld Elements // New Users
Post by Dlangar // Apr 30, 2008, 9:26am
|
Dlangar
Total Posts: 13
|
So I'm doing all my modeling in Workspace mode. For the most part I love workspace mode -- the viewport is about a billion times cleaner and easier to decipher than model mode, and the widgets are, in my humble opinion, far superior. But I keep running into a problem that's become so pervasive I'm starting to think I'm missing something fundamental.
The problem arises when I attempt to join two distinct pieces of geometry into one, using Encapsulate in 3D and Weld Elements. My workflow goes something like this..
I model the body of a character in one scene. In an altogether different scene, I model the head. I save the head as an .rSOBJ, return to the original scene, and load the head object into my original scene.
I scale and position the head appropriately.
I then select the head, ctrl-select the body (so that they are both selected), and then hit Encapsulate in 3D.
I then go into point edit mode, and begin positioning and welding the verts from the bottom of the neck to the top of the shoulders.
This is where I get into trouble. After welding a vert from the head object to the body object, it's as if Truespace doesn't REALLY think they're welded. If I choose "pick and paint" on the freshly welded vert and tug on it, it comes apart, showing two distinct verts still! It doesn't seem to matter how I select the verts -- rectangle select or pick and paint using ctrl to add to the selection -- after I weld, I still don' have a "single" vert.
It's as if truespace doesnt want to "really' combine the two objects into one. So I'm beginning to think I'm not really understanding what "Encapsulate in 3D" means. If it's just a grouping mechanism.. that's fine, but then what *is* the correct way to combine two distinct objects in such a way that Truespace thinks you actually have just one, single piece of geometry?
PS - the only way I've been able to so far convince truespace that the end thing I want is a single piece of geometry is to go into model mode and use Object Union to join the pieces together. This is rife with it's own horrors, as half the time the union tool complains it can't complete the operation for reasons I don't full understand, and even when it can it is likely to perturb the geometry in ways I don't want.
Anyhoo, any insight into what I'm doing wrong, or what the correct way to join two distinct pieces of geometry into one piece on the Workspace side would be *greatly* appreciated.
Thanks tons,
Dlangar |
Post by TomG // Apr 30, 2008, 10:23am
|
TomG
Total Posts: 3397
|
Encapsulate in 3D is like the "Glue" tool over on the Model side - it does not fuse the geometry into one. Instead, it just creates a group so that scale, move and transforms can be applied to the whole group.
There are no booleans on the workspace side at present. What you want though is the Polygon Bridge / Blend tool in the workspace point edit tools. Select both objects at once (in my test I just did CTRL click), active the Blend tool, select faces on object 1, select faces on object 2, a bridge is created connecting the two, hit space when happy. Then Flatten History.
This should in fact create a nice neck area for you when attaching a head onto the body. If desired, you should now be able to select and weld vertices as the two objects should now be one.
HTH!
Tom |
Post by Dlangar // Apr 30, 2008, 10:39am
|
Dlangar
Total Posts: 13
|
Awesome Thomas that sounds exactly like what I'm looking for. I'll give it a try next time I get a break at work. One n00bish follow-up question -- where do I flatten the command history? I've seen in other modellers where to collapse the stack, but couldn't find it in Truespace.
Thanks again! |
Post by trueBlue // Apr 30, 2008, 10:41am
|
trueBlue
Total Posts: 1761
|
The Flatten tool is amongst the Encapsulate tools. |
Post by Dlangar // Apr 30, 2008, 2:26pm
|
Dlangar
Total Posts: 13
|
Hmmmm...
First, thanks Blue for pointing me out to the flatten History tool. I miss the Icon finder in 6.6... o.O
But I still seem to be unable to join meshes, even using the polybridge tool. Maybe it's a bug, or more likely, maybe it's still me failing to do something. I've got my repro case down to rock simple.
Start with a clean scene in Workspace mode, and place two cubes down, one beside the other.
Select one cube, then the other (using ctrl select), and then right-click to enter point edit mode.
Select the two faces between the two cubes that "face" each other. That is, the one face from each cube that faces the other cube -- again using ctrl-select, with Face as the context.
Hit the Poly Bridge tool. With default settings, it creates a nice clean hull bridging the two cubes. So far so good. r-click on the poly-bridge tool to bring up the settings, and uncheck 'create caps', but leave checked 'delete interior faces'.
Click one of the other selection tools (pick and paint, for example), to exit the poly bridge tool. It creates geometry between the two cubes.
Flatten the history. This takes you out of point edit mode, so r-click now to go back into point edit mode.
Now here's there things are broken for me..
First, there's an interior face on one edge where the new geometry meets one of the original cubes. For me, it's the cube on the right, if you haven't moved your camera from the default scene view. I turned off create caps, and turned on 'remove interior faces', so there shouldn't be a face there, right?
Second, enter vert context, pick and paint, and select one of the verts that's adjacent to that interior face, and tug it back. It comes apart! You can actually peel all four verts from the original cube back from the hull created by the poly bridge tool.
So.. still trying to correct the problem.. I pulled the verts back, and deleted that interior face. I then moved the verts back close to the verts from the new poly bridge hull, and welded them together.
This is the part that makes me think it might just be a bug..
If you weld one of the verts from the original cube to the vert from the new polybridge hull, after you weld them, without deselecting that vert, you can tug and push and pull on that vert and it moves around like a single vert -- that is, it appears welded correctly. But if you then deselect that vert, and then reselect it and tug on it, they come back apart! You cannot make them stay welded, lol!
Anyway, sorry for being so long-winded. If my explanation is a little too convoluted, or the problem doesn't repro for you, I'll be happy to post up some piccies with further explanation. :)
Thanks again,
Dlangar |
Post by SteveBe // Apr 30, 2008, 2:41pm
|
SteveBe
Total Posts: 282
|
Hi Dlangar,
Try using MeshCollapse plug-in on model side. Should be in ts/tsx folder,
same place as luuv plug-in is. This should unify your meshes. You can then
use the bridge tool on workSpace side. I have had better results with the
bridge tool doing one vert. at a time and you will still need to delete back
faces of new polys.
HTH |
Post by Jack Edwards // Apr 30, 2008, 2:54pm
|
Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
|
Another feature you may want to make use of Dlanger, is if you use the primitive creation tools while in Mesh Edit mode the primitive's mesh will automatically be added to the mesh of the object you are currently editing.
Other than that, the only way to combine meshes for Mesh editing is to boolean them in Model side or like Steve mentions, use the Mesh Collapse plugin on Model side. |
Post by Dlangar // May 1, 2008, 6:08am
|
Dlangar
Total Posts: 13
|
Dear Caligari.. please give us a way to *actually* combine meshes into a single object in workspace mode for 7.6. Love, Dlangar. :)
Thanks everyone for the replies -- I didn't know about the Mesh Collapse plugin, and I learned that you can boolean union two objects together that aren't physically touching yet -- this allows you to avoid the union operation from mangling your verts.
And that was what I finally did -- use a combination of Mesh collapse and Boolean Union in Model mode. The eyes I had joined with the head in Encapsulate 3D. I dropped into model mode, and used the Mesh Collapse plugin on the head/eyes object, and that merged them into a single object. I then moved my head and hands each close to the respective places on the model, and one by one unioned them to the model. Switched immediately back to workspace mode, and in point edit mode with rectangle select, moved each piece the rest of the way to the model, then welded the joining verts together.
YAY! When I was done I had what I wanted, a single piece of geometry that contained all of the head, the hands, and the body. Anyway, just wanted to say thanks to you guys -- couldn't have got there without this forum.
Now.. on to rigging and animation! Woot!
Dlangar |
Post by TomG // May 1, 2008, 6:47am
|
TomG
Total Posts: 3397
|
The forum does indeed rock :) We have a great community here, very helpful, and it is an excellent resource to make use of when tackling a problem. Usually someone somewhere has just the right solution for you!
As a note, all this info has gone into the beta process to see if this situation can be given a smoother workflow to attain the end result you were looking for.
HTH!
Tom |
|
