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Virtual Earth Questions
About Truespace Archives
These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
Virtual Earth Questions // New Users
Post by Steinie // Aug 29, 2008, 6:34am
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Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
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What exactly do we the user need to do to get Virtual Earth since there is no link on the Main Caligari page or in the instructions for entering the Gallery.
Try Googling "Virtual Earth" and see what come up first. Nope not "MicroSoft Virtual Earth" the first link wants Money. Apparently there are other Virtual Earths out there.
So I try another link and nowhere does it have a link to download. On to the third link...
Do I need Virtual Earth "Live" or Virtual Earth "3D" or Virtual Earth "Beta"?
I "think" I have it now....let me send my scene, click the "Expot to VE" icon fill out the form as per your instructions in a video and..."Error Event Export to VE collection not finished succesfully"
That tells me a lot! I really don't think your going to get many submissions unless the instructions get better. Please show me anywhere on your site where there is a link to "Virtual Earth" |
Post by splinters // Aug 29, 2008, 6:37am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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I had the same trouble Stenie, perhaps this subject deserves a sticky from someone in the know.
I got Virtual Earth, then the 3D beta and had to get the 3Dvia element as well to be able to mess with 3D models. Nedded a Live account as well.
I would never have figured this out intuitively; TomG helped me through it...but it was not without some dificulty...:o |
Post by TomG // Aug 29, 2008, 6:45am
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TomG
Total Posts: 3397
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Virtual Earth is part of the overall MS mapping solution, so just visit Maps Live:
http://maps.live.com/
Click on 3D and you will install Virtual Earth Beta as it will be called. Once those install instructions are done, you have installed Virtual Earth.
The manual goes into detail on this and includes that link to get Virtual Earth (appendix D). You will need a Windows Live ID, again this is mentioned in the manual, just follow the "Sign up" process on the maps live site if you don't have one.
The export process is covered in detail in the manual. The Bitesize videos cover the same thing in video form:
http://forums1.caligari.com/truespace/showthread.php?t=6193
The videos cover details such as having holes etc that can cause artefacts. Very large objects could cause a problem (pretty excessively large though). Other objects it would be useful for us to see the RsScn or RsObj, in case you have hit upon some new bug. EDIT or just a screen grab or similar if you cannot share the object :) END EDIT
HTH!
Tom |
Post by Steinie // Aug 29, 2008, 8:19am
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Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
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I got Virtual Earth, then the 3D beta and had to get the 3Dvia element as well to be able to mess with 3D models. Nedded a Live account as well.
Why do I need a Live account? When I started to create an account to Live it said I would be responsible for all charges. I quit the signup.
So do I need both? Is this Free? |
Post by TomG // Aug 29, 2008, 8:44am
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TomG
Total Posts: 3397
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A Windows Live account is free - it handles things like gamer tags, msn messenger, skydrive, and a whole range of windows live services. There are no charges (though I am sure there are some services somewhere that you might pay for - never found one yet, but I would guess something like extra skydrive storage or larger email accounts for msn hotmail).
If you have a passport id etc then most likely you already have a Windows Live account.
You need one as there needs to be some server space on Virtual Earth to store your objects, and some way to protect those so that they belong to you and you can decide what happens to them (who gets to see them, whether people can copy them or not, etc, plus ensures only you can move them, add them, add comments etc).
There are no charges involved in either setting up the Windows Live ID, or in using VE though. Export will fail if there is no Windows Live ID, as there won't be the username and password protected receiving server space to be able to store the uploaded objects.
Let me know if you get stuck any place!
HTH!
Tom
PS - here is the Windows Live ID information page:
https://accountservices.passport.net/ppnetworkhome.srf?vv=600&lc=1033
The ID is of course not VE specific but runs across all MS services.
PPS - I believe the 3DVia install is optional if you just plan on uploading from tS, but not done a full test to see if that is the case. No harm in installing 3DVia anyway I guess, but you could try without it first if you like and I don't think it will interfere with tS's export, or the display of 3D objects in VE. |
Post by teamonkey // Aug 29, 2008, 8:56am
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teamonkey
Total Posts: 107
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Why do I need a Live account? When I started to create an account to Live it said I would be responsible for all charges. I quit the signup.
So do I need both? Is this Free?
All these hoops to have to jump through are hardly likely to encourage TS users to want to get involved.
Or is that what they want? :confused:
It certainly seems that way right now. They need to encourage people to sign up to get things rolling and people invoved. |
Post by TomG // Aug 29, 2008, 8:59am
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TomG
Total Posts: 3397
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Hmm I dont see much of a hoop - you need a Windows Live ID. Only one hoop :) Once done, tS export and VE (and other windows live sites) remember it for you automatically so you never need think about it again.
HTH!
Tom |
Post by JimB // Aug 29, 2008, 9:00am
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JimB
Total Posts: 341
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If you are a Windows Live Messenger user you only have to sign in,if not its a simple sign up process hardly difficult. :)
Also 5gig of SkyDrive is very useful and free.
Jim |
Post by TomG // Aug 29, 2008, 9:10am
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TomG
Total Posts: 3397
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Just wanted to reiterate that the Windows Live ID is not a requirement of tS export to VE, it's a requirement of maps live. If you want to have bookmarks on maps, make tours, store directions, etc, then you need a Live ID. As a result, the same applies if you want to make and place 3D objects onto Virtual Earth (whether you make those objects in 3DVia or tS), to use those components of the mapping services there, you need to have a sign in to have some protected space allocated to you so you can save your unique settings and creations.
So the ID is required to use those mapping services, which is where tS export sends your objects (they need someplace to be stored under a username and password protected system).
HTH!
Tom |
Post by teamonkey // Aug 29, 2008, 10:16am
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teamonkey
Total Posts: 107
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Hmm I dont see much of a hoop - you need a Windows Live ID. Only one hoop :) Once done, tS export and VE (and other windows live sites) remember it for you automatically so you never need think about it again.
HTH!
Tom
Not much to you-you deal with all this stuff on a daily basis. There needs to be a simple and obvious way to get going on this. Even your instructions here are not obvious in a few days as this thread will get buried. It needs to be on the front page and very obvious.
Your remarks remind me of programmer types that still don't see the point of a gui because they use a command line all the time and that works fine for them!
Think of the users. What the heck is a Windows Live ID? Where do I get one? Does it cost anything? What's it for? What else do I need to get started on all this Virtual Earth thingy? Etc,etc, ad nauseum until most TS vetran users and new users can easily find out what is going on and get involved.
I didn't even know that we could get going on this stuff until Steinie mentioned it. Thought all the stuff mentioned was still unreleased.
As frequently as I come here, there aren't enough hours in the day to read every thread, let alone every post.:rolleyes: |
Post by TomG // Aug 29, 2008, 10:53am
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TomG
Total Posts: 3397
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That's why it is all covered in the manual :) What a Windows Live ID is is also covered in the sign up (since it's a Windows service, best that it is covered there).
Note that this is no different from visiting a new message board and needing to sign up. Or making a new friend who uses a different IM and you need to sign up. Or finding a new social networking site and deciding to sign up. New sign ups for new services are common, and since this is a straight sign up and nothing odd due to it being 3D, it won't be any harder than any of those other cases above.
I don't really deal with this on a daily basis - I signed up once for VE access and now I just click things in tS :)
Explanations in the forums and the videos are stickied, to be right up top for new forum visitors. A web cast covering some of this is planned. Once bitesize videos get to enough in number, they will probably appear on a web page. So we are not taking the approach you mention of the programmer saying command line is fine, we are continually producing new training materials, and of course we'll be continually looking at the process too.
I can say that it is far easier getting my object into VE than it is into XNA, Max, other 3D apps, etc - all of which are things people also have to deal with here, and out of those, the VE export is simpler than most :)
HTH!
Tom |
Post by teamonkey // Aug 30, 2008, 8:34am
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teamonkey
Total Posts: 107
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[QUOTE=TomG;79119]
Points well taken, Tom. It's just that when you're first learning all this stuff it's swirling around like a tornado around you and very little of it seems obvious or plainly evident or even logical sometimes.
YMMV.
Cheers |
Post by Steinie // Aug 30, 2008, 9:55am
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Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
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I'm just stupid!... |
Post by teamonkey // Aug 30, 2008, 10:40am
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teamonkey
Total Posts: 107
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I'm just stupid!...
Was that a crack at my post? It certainly looked like it. If so, it's not appreciated.
Being confused in a new area of learning is not the same as being stupid.
Even you were new before you got your thousands of posts. Please remember that! |
Post by splinters // Aug 30, 2008, 10:50am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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I doubt it was a crack at you teamonkey..Steinie is not like that. More likely he is being sarcastic at the process needed to get set up as in " oh, that easy you say...must be me being stupid".
Either that or he has finally admitted what we all aready knew (joke, before anyone retaliates)...:D
No need to get defensive, we have all read posts the wrong way in the past...I certainly have. |
Post by teamonkey // Aug 30, 2008, 10:58am
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teamonkey
Total Posts: 107
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I doubt it was a crack at you teamonkey..Steinie is not like that. More likely he is being sarcastic at the process needed to get set up as in " oh, that easy you say...must be me being stupid".
Either that or he has finally admitted what we all aready knew (joke, before anyone retaliates)...:D
No need to get defensive, we have all read posts the wrong way in the past...I certainly have.
Thanks Splinters, it was hard to know how to take it. I didn't want to think the worst, but still felt I had to call him on it cause it didn't quite look right. |
Post by Steinie // Aug 30, 2008, 1:24pm
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Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
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Don't worry teamonkey if it was about you I would have misquoted you. That remark was purely about myself and nothing to do with you.
Splinters is right, I would never do that to someone else. Sorry about the confusion.
Let's make it more clear.
Dear TomG.
I'm PDF Stupid.
Yours truly
Steinie
p.s. you guys decided to do away with books and only give us PDFs. Sorry but if all this was in a book I would be BOOK smart. It takes me longer to go through a PDF when I would rather read forum post and design stuff with trueSpace. Plus your information seems to be all over the place but not on the front page of Caligari, yet the new focus and direction of the Company is now VE. |
Post by teamonkey // Aug 30, 2008, 1:32pm
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teamonkey
Total Posts: 107
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Don't worry teamonkey if it was about you I would have misquoted you. That remark was purely about myself and nothing to do with you.
Splinters is right, I would never do that to someone else. Sorry about the confusion.
Let's make it more clear.
Dear TomG.
I'm PDF Stupid.
Yours truly
Steinie
p.s. you guys decided to do away with books and only give us PDFs. Sorry but if all this was in a book I would be BOOK smart. It takes me longer to go through a PDF when I would rather read forum post and design stuff with trueSpace. Plus your information seems to be all over the place but not on the front page of Caligari.
We're cool, Steinie-no probs. If I was REAL offended, I would have put it in New Joisey speak so you'd understand! ;)
"So what's it to ya PAL???" Like that! :D
"PDF stupid?" Jeez, I am slow today-I was thinking: "Personal Document File" ? "Pretty Damn F****** stupid? Something else? :p
Not my day, I tell ya-I'm gonna go hibernate! |
Post by TomG // Aug 30, 2008, 1:55pm
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TomG
Total Posts: 3397
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Nobody here is stupid for sure :)
The process, and the information about it, can sure use improvement, and that will be ongoing. We do need your feedback for that, and knowing that it's tougher than it ought to be is important. If you are finding it tough, then it could use improvement.
Hopefully the items I've directed everyone to here will in the meantime let you get up to speed through the original lack of clarity, and then hopefully we can go and tidy up this info, make it more accessible, and even better perhaps even simplify the process too.
HTH!
Tom |
Post by teamonkey // Aug 30, 2008, 4:29pm
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teamonkey
Total Posts: 107
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Well said Tom-got on 'ya! :-) |
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