Newbie - A few questions

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Newbie - A few questions // New Users

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Post by watupbrudda // Apr 30, 2009, 6:09am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
Hey guys,


First and foremost, thanks for taking the time to read this.


As you probably guessed from the title, I'm a complete newbie to truespace. I'm using it to attempt to do the modeling/animating for cut scenes to a strategy game.


I'm getting the hang of the actual buildings now, and getting better at modelling structures etc. but now I'm starting to look at terrain and textures I'm getting a bit stuck.


Ok, first, I would like to have a flowing river on my map. Is that at all possible in truespace? If so, please help me! :)


Next, how would you recommend landscaping the terrain i.e. hills, ravines and slopes etc.


Finally, how do you create textures to use? I have several image files I'd like to use as textures for things like the castle walls and woodwork on buildings, but not sure how to use them with truespace? Do i have to convert them first?


Again, excuse me if something I say sounds completely novice, as that is what I am.


Thanks to any help given, and well done to everyone on these forums as the stuff I've seen is fantastic *feels slightly jealous*


~Watup

Post by prodigy // Apr 30, 2009, 6:35am

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Total Posts: 3029
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hi wat........da (weird nick :D)

there's a few ways to create terrain..

1) modeling by hand.
2) from a texture using displacement mapping

For point 1) create a plane add some faces on it.. and start pull up and down the mesh (verts or edges).. that will create hills in the ground..

if you are new, i will recomend you to use displacement mapping but.. the problem with displacement is you need a high quality mesh to do that..

About textures.. you can use google images to find textures.. example put Stone wall texture and you will find several stone textures.. For that you will need to paint a 2d picture in any software such photoshop, you will need to create a height map.. like this ones..

http://images.google.com/images?q=height+map&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:es-ES:official&client=firefox

the height map is a gray scale image that can be loaded in the displacement map.. and it works moving verts up if that are in white, and pull down the verts that are in black.. (sorry the poor exp).

On big point, you will need seamless textures so if you repeat the texture along a wall you will not find where the texture start or end.. that is good for games and renders..

Jpg, bmp, tga, png are the most common file formats.. so if you use this file extensions you are in..

Create textures, you can create your own using photoshop, Gimp or photopaint, or better go around your neighbour and take some pictures from the walls, grass, concrete etc..

fell free to ask more questions, and sorry if my english, i know is not the best in the net. ;)

Cheers

Post by watupbrudda // Apr 30, 2009, 6:47am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
Hey prodigy. Thanks for getting back to me.


One question - how do I get it from a jpg/png or whatever file format, onto my walls? Also, how do i create a heightmap?


Thanks.

Post by prodigy // Apr 30, 2009, 6:57am

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Total Posts: 3029
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First at all which side are you using?

Model or Workspace?

After that question.. do you own vray?

im uploading a video showing how to create landscapes in a few clicks.. ;)

Post by watupbrudda // Apr 30, 2009, 7:00am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
Workspace....


And no i don't own Vray :(

Post by prodigy // Apr 30, 2009, 7:05am

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Total Posts: 3029
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http://rapidshare.com/files/227597413/Untitled.rar.html
Xvid codec needed..

Height map from Hawaii. ;)
http://www.vis.uni-stuttgart.de/javatevi/data/Default_HeightMap.png

*remember you will find your displacement tool cos i use my own layout.. the icon tool will be the same..

Steps:
1) Save the image on your hard drive.

2) Create a plane (to be sure you can set a Plane Uv map but by default planes use plane uv)

3) click on the displacement tool, that will open a panel on your stack.

4) Drag and drop your png or jpg as i do image zone, that will load the image into the displacement tool.. (other way is Ctrl + click.)

And that's all..

Post by watupbrudda // Apr 30, 2009, 7:12am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
Wow - thanks a lot for the video! Was very useful!


One last question...


I have a stone texture jpg that I want to put on one of my walls - how do I do this?


Thanks


Watup

Post by prodigy // Apr 30, 2009, 7:16am

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Total Posts: 3029
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DX materials has a very bad UI.. very complicated for the common users and more if you are new... so you can try adding some DX shaders with textures form your TS library and modifie it or go to model side and use Lightworks materials.. will be much easier for you..

must go now, both of my kids are sick and need to go to the doctor..
i'll make another video showing how to add textures in dx if you like but trust me modelside will be much easier for you..

Post by prodigy // Apr 30, 2009, 7:18am

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Total Posts: 3029
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you need to create a material and add your texture.. then paint the faces and that's all..
there's a few other things to know like UV but by now start practicing with materials will be the best..

Maybe another user can continue explaining here.. must gooooo!! :)

Post by watupbrudda // Apr 30, 2009, 8:25am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
OK - thanks for that.


How exactly do I create a material and add a texture? :S Sorry for all these questions but I'm very newbie at truespace.

Post by Jack Edwards // Apr 30, 2009, 8:27am

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Total Posts: 4062
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Use the TextureBump material from D3D materials library if you need to apply a diffuse texture and normal map to an object. Then CTRL-click on the bitmap parts of it to get the file browse dialog to select the images to use.

For a ground shader you're probably going to want to blend two or more textures to get a less tiled look:
http://forums1.caligari.com/truespace/showthread.php?t=5233

Post by watupbrudda // Apr 30, 2009, 10:10am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
Thanks very much for that jack edwards. It helped a lot. I understand now.


Now my final question reasked - can you create water/rivers in truespace?

Post by v3rd3 // Apr 30, 2009, 1:26pm

v3rd3
Total Posts: 388
Like every good question on this forum the answer should begin with "It depends"..... Water and fluid simulation are definitely in the medium to advanced part of 3d work but I can give you my simple cave man explanation here.


You can create the illusion of water by using animated textures on planes. Essentially, the plane lies flat in your scene and the texture plays a movie of running or rippling water like a move on a cinema screen. You can combine this with texture transparency to create some effects as well.


If you want to add increased realism you can create the illusion of small waves on the plane by applying a bumpmap or normal map to the plane.


You can go to a higher level with fluid simulation. Fluid simulation requires that you use a polygon mesh, reasonably dense to show the movement of the fluid, and apply some algorithms to generate the animation you need.


Fluid simulation was accomplished on the model side using plugins that are no longer available.


Fluid simulation can be accomplished on the workspace side using a plugin developed by frootee. You can find out more about frootee's plugin here


http://forums1.caligari.com/truespace/showthread.php?t=7504


Bigger heads than mine (ie ppl like Jack that actually know what they are talking about) will try to help you with this subject as well so check back here for their responses.

Post by prodigy // Apr 30, 2009, 3:39pm

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Agree.. there's a lot of ways to create water..

You can use Bumpmap
you can use displacement mapping (instead a mountain you can use a wave map)

http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20060103/18-2.jpg

you can use plugins.. etc..etc..etc.. all depends if you needs... if will be animated, static, etc..etc..

Post by TomG // May 1, 2009, 1:10am

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Total Posts: 3397
I guess it depends on what you mean by "create a river". What is the end purpose? So it looks good in an image? So it looks good in a pre-rendered animation? So it looks good in real-time in trueSpace? So it looks good in a real-time game? So that it works functionally, ie anything that falls into it gets moved by the river automatically?


Just what you need the river to do and what you need it to be will affect the route you take for a solution. In 3D, you decide just what aspects you want to be trying to simulate. Does it have to just look ok in a still for a brief glance as people's focus will be elsewhere, or does it have to move and have the water part around someone's foot as they step in the stream, etc.


Let everyone know what it is you want to achieve in your final product, and it will let people specify just what route or routes would be best to get there.


HTH!

Tom

Post by watupbrudda // May 1, 2009, 6:06am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
Hey all


Basically, I'm using it to create an intro cut-scene for a game. I'm going to have several movements in it, maybe a soldier moving, or something swaying in the wind or something - hopefully when i get there relatively simple things, but also a flowing river.


Just to give you a general idea of what I'm trying to achieve here is what I've done so far.


http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f223/watupbrudda/toupload.jpg


The castle is going to be on the hill at the back, and the camera is going to move down the river (the blue bit) which i would like to be flowing, and in through the gatehouse. Obviously i need to do lots of work on textures yet, but i wanted to try and get the river done.


Thanks for all the help


Watup

Post by Jack Edwards // May 2, 2009, 1:59am

Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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Looks like you're off to a great start! You may want to start a WIP thread in the WIP section of the forum so you can get advice, critiques, and encouragement as you continue to work on the project.

Best of luck! :)

Post by watupbrudda // May 2, 2009, 2:38am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
Thanks for that jack. Will start a WIP thread when i find the time :P

Post by prodigy // May 2, 2009, 8:35am

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Total Posts: 3029
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Your problem is quite simple.

First hide your ground, add a plane and move it down under the ground lvl. add a water or mirror material with a nice bumpmap and that will do the trick.

nice to meet you and good luck in your project..

Post by Breech Block // May 2, 2009, 8:46am

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Even at this early stage, this is looking really good. It has a very nice Rome: Total War look about it.


Welcome to the forums BTW. :)

Post by watupbrudda // May 3, 2009, 6:50am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
THanks for that Breech Block.


Prodigy - What if i wanted the water to be moving?

Post by Breech Block // May 3, 2009, 7:01am

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Total Posts: 844
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What if i wanted the water to be moving?


You just have to use an animated bump map.

Post by watupbrudda // May 3, 2009, 8:11am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
Sorry for being so unknowledgeable here but what is a bumpmap?

Post by spacekdet // May 3, 2009, 8:39am

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Total Posts: 1360
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Some 3D Glossaries (http://www.google.com/#hl=en&q=3D+Glossary&btnG=Google+Search&aq=f&oq=3D+Glossary&fp=cstJsZcXi7Y) where these terms are defined.

Post by watupbrudda // May 3, 2009, 9:23am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
Hey - i now understand what a bump map is. So now - how do I make an animated bumpmap, and how do I use it in truespace?

Post by watupbrudda // May 3, 2009, 11:19pm

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
Hey guys - change of plan. I know it's possible to make an animated displacement map (I've seen Dele's scripts etc.) but could someway please explain to me how in the simplest way possible?

Post by Breech Block // May 4, 2009, 1:22am

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Visit Turbosquid and buy them.

Post by watupbrudda // May 4, 2009, 2:00am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
I have all the bmps and jpgs (texture sequences, normals, and displacement sequences) but I don't know how to use them in truespace - i.e. how to make an objects displacement map animated?

Post by v3rd3 // May 4, 2009, 4:17am

v3rd3
Total Posts: 388
You would use a 2d graphics program to animate any texture/bump map...etc



You would have to create individual frames as files and use the tool in the link below to bring them into worksapce. Workspace itself does not natively support animated textures so the tool in the link below is essential.



http://forums1.caligari.com/truespace/showthread.php?t=5820&highlight=animate+texture


On the model side you would create your frame by frame texture and use the material editor to apply it to your object.


The material editor has an animation button on the top left corner. The border looks like a film strip.


Good hunting.

Post by watupbrudda // May 4, 2009, 5:36am

watupbrudda
Total Posts: 25
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f223/watupbrudda/Untitled-1.jpg


Hey - I'm using Dele's scripts here to attempt to make an animated texture and height map. By looking at that - could someone tell me if it looks like I'm doing it right? Cos i don't know how to tell if it's going to animate or not? How do i play the script/animation thing?


SOrry for the noobyness, and thanks to everyone for their help.
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