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Time in a Bottle
About Truespace Archives
These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
Time in a Bottle // Image Gallery
Post by W!ZARD // Oct 9, 2006, 10:19pm
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W!ZARD
Total Posts: 2603
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A couple of weeks ago my partner started rehearsing "Time in a bottle" the song by Jim Croce. She's a talented pianist and she often plays in the next room when I'm modelling. Of course that song has been playing in my head over and over, even when she's not practicing!
Anyway, I woke up one morning with this idea in my head for a picture - and here it is at last. Firstly I made the background image of the ruined city using Vue 5 esprit. The suspension bridge was built using trueSpace 6.6 and everything else is made with vue.
The forground is all 100% trueSpace. The grand piano is a reworked version of the one that ships with the tS object libraries as is the chair. The streetlights, brick wall, plastered wall, windows, music stand, bottle, clock (inside bottle) and the hourglass were all made bt me with tS 6.6 after some really looooong renders. Almost every texture is multi-layered in some way or another.
I'm not sure if it really captures the idea of 'Time in a bottle' but I'm feeling like I've taken it as far as I want to at this stage so here it is for you to look at and hopefully enjoy
As usual, all and any feedback is most welcome.
Stephen
W!ZARD. |
Post by Nez // Oct 10, 2006, 2:46am
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Nez
Total Posts: 1102
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I like it! I'm assuming your Vue background is used simply as a 'matte' backdrop? I like how you've done a good job of matching the colour of the lighting from that to apply to your truespace model.
Is the bridge the same one as in your space station? Any chevy box vans on it this time? ;) The textures are great - I've not tried layered textures but the ageing looks really good.
Only two things look very slightly odd to me:
1) the damaged walls of the room have a fairly smoothly curved break-edge at the top which seems a little unnatural - would usually expect a very angular finish, depending on whether it's masonry, concrete, timber etc
2) for some reason, the chair on it's side doesn't look quite right but I can't put my finger on why.
The amount of stuff you seem to be churning out on various thredas is very impressive - how much time do you spend modelling in a typical day/week? |
Post by Jack Edwards // Oct 10, 2006, 5:40am
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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This is very cool W!zard! :-)
It definitely has an aged feel to it.
My thought about the image is that even with all the detail it looks a bit flat... likely an issue with the lighting. But it does match the background. I notice that there are no blacks or deep darks in the image to provide a contrast to the lighter areas. Also I think this image could really benefit from GI and caustics. The background image could even be used at the lightsource... maybe even try IBL?
-Jack. |
Post by parva // Oct 10, 2006, 6:48am
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parva
Total Posts: 822
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I like the story which lies in that picture :) |
Post by W!ZARD // Oct 14, 2006, 4:36am
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W!ZARD
Total Posts: 2603
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Hi Nez
Thanks for the kind words! In answer to your questions. Yes the Vue background is used as a matte backdrop - it's painted on a cube rather than using the background shader as you can get better control of the image that way. Yes the bridge is the one from the space station minus the chevies! Well spotted sir!
Layering textures is heaps of fun - the material editor in tS is brilliant IMHO and making the textures is almost as much fun as the actual modelling.
Thanks for your critiques - yes the wall IS a bit smooth, I'd not actually noticed that! The top is sort of angular though - maybe the edges got smoothed off over time!
The chair - now you mention it it does look a little odd - it's the one that ships in tS's object library only I've smashed it up a bit - one leg has been bent out of alignment which may be why it looks a little odd.
As to how much time I spend modelling each week - it varies a lot depending on my health (which is not always as good as I'd like) and on how much 'real world' stuff I have to do - shopping, mowing lawns, writing emails, cruising the forums... 3DE modelling and art is great therapy for me - I'm not aware of all my aches and pains when I'm engrossed in modelling so I like to spend as much time as I can at it.
j_edwards, thanks Jack! You could be right about this one looking a little flat - for a start it hasn't generated a lopt of feedback here or elewhere which is usually an indication that a picture hasn't quite worked as well as I'd hoped!
Your observation about the lighting is probably on the money - I did try it with a 12 light IBL - took ages to render and had lots of stepped shadow artifacts which I didn't like - this one was rendered with a 'hedgehog' of low powered infinite lights - 17 of them - plus a bright one for the sunlight.
Part of the challenge was matching the colours with the background matte. Also I'm using tS 6.6 which does not support true GI (apart from TJVikings Fast GI shader which would be a nightmare to set up given all the layered textures used) or caustics. I did think about faking the caustics but by that time I'd sort of gotten tired of the picture - it took a while to get it to this stage.
My own opinion is that it's just a bit too busy - too much going on and an ambiguous centre of attention.
Parva - Hi Marcel, thanks for commenting. I'm glad you like the story though I'd prefer it if you liked the picture!! Back to the drawing board I think!
Thanks again folks
Stephen
W!ZARD |
Post by Steinie // Oct 14, 2006, 5:09am
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Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
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Hi Wizard,
Here is my two cents... I would try to get the eye to move to the center of the rendering so two things come to mind.
Reverse the window frame on the right so it angles toward the center and the chair is taking my eye out of the picture not in. Too much clutter on the piano. I'm not sure if the hour glass is adding anything to the message except "time has run out" or "Time in a bottle"
On the left you have bricks, the bridge and part of a window frame at the same height, so the depth perception is getting wacked. |
Post by Alien // Oct 14, 2006, 9:39am
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Alien
Total Posts: 1231
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Just a few points on this 1.
Stuff I like:
The overall look of the city in the background.
The texture on that section of wall where the plaster has fallen away.
Stuff I'm not so keen on:
Tint on the body of the hour-glass doesn't look right. I think it would look better if it was clear glass with grime on it, instead of tinted glass.
The timepiece in the bottle is kinda hard to see.
The music stand needs a little more tarnishing in the upper right quadrant.
As already meantioned, the chair doesn't look right in the way it's lying on the floor.
The buildings in the ruined city look a bit too uniform in height.
Sorry there's more crits than praise, but I do like the piece over all. |
Post by Nez // Oct 17, 2006, 12:09am
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Nez
Total Posts: 1102
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Hi Nez
Thanks for the kind words! In answer to your questions. Yes the Vue background is used as a matte backdrop - it's painted on a cube rather than using the background shader as you can get better control of the image that way.
[snip...]
As to how much time I spend modelling each week - it varies a lot depending on my health (which is not always as good as I'd like) and on how much 'real world' stuff I have to do - shopping, mowing lawns, writing emails, cruising the forums... 3DE modelling and art is great therapy for me - I'm not aware of all my aches and pains when I'm engrossed in modelling so I like to spend as much time as I can at it.
Stephen
W!ZARD
Out of curiosity - iI can see that having the matte on a cube rather than as a bg shader gives you more control on the positioning in particular, but is it not a headache with lighting? When I've tried similar things, the matte is of course illuminated by the scene lighting, which can cause unwanted effects. I presuume that's perhaps partly why your scene lighting (all those infinite lights you mentioned) was pretty complex?
Not meaning to pry, but you mention your health; as a newcomer, I'm obviously still getting to know folks here so don't know everyone's history, but I take it you are implying a chronic illness rather than a short term problem? None of my business, I know - I have Crohn's disease which seems comparatively unknown but can leave me very uncomfortable at times. I work full time and have a long commute, plus two toddlers, so my time for cg is limited in the extreme (although signing up here has re-sparked my interest). I guess I asked about how much time you have for modelling as I don't know who on the forum is working full time, students or at home, etc - there's certainly a number of folks who seem to have producing a tremendous volume of work.
Anyway, keep up the good work, and thanks for the answers. |
Post by TomG // Oct 17, 2006, 1:22am
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TomG
Total Posts: 3397
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Hi Nez,
If you use the Constant shader as your reflectance shader, then the material on the cube will not be affected by lights in the scene. It will be a static color, the brightness never changing no matter what the lighting in the scene.
For a little more control, you can use the Matte shader, turn off the Diffuse channel (which responds to scene lighting), and just use the Luminosity (or Ambient if you are in an older version of tS) channel. This will give you a constant brightness unaffected by scene lighting, but you can then control the brightness using the Luminosity / Ambient channel rather than being stuck with exactly the brightness of the image like the Constant shader.
Both ways let you use sky spheres and sky boxes :) Final step is to turn off Receive Shadows and Cast Shadows, and then your object is unaffected by the lighting, and doesn't affect the lighting.
HTH!
Tom |
Post by Nez // Oct 17, 2006, 1:51am
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Nez
Total Posts: 1102
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Thanks Tom
I'd never noticed the Constant shader before; guess I need to spend some more time going through some of the basic features and testing all of the shaders out a bit to see what gives effects I like. By the way, I'm using TS5.1.
I've never really tried any external shots before either, so I've not tried sky-spheres/boxes. Do you know of any good threads/tutorials showing how to use these?
Thanks for the help. |
Post by spacekdet // Oct 17, 2006, 6:36am
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spacekdet
Total Posts: 1360
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Skydome tutorial. (http://www.spacekdet.com/tutorials/skydome/) |
Post by Weevil // Oct 18, 2006, 2:13am
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Weevil
Total Posts: 534
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HOLY...!!!
Dude that is AWSOME, great fact that Truespace can import models from godknows how many other programs.
Dude.......wow.....just...wow |
Post by W!ZARD // Oct 25, 2006, 4:45am
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W!ZARD
Total Posts: 2603
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Out of curiosity - iI can see that having the matte on a cube rather than as a bg shader gives you more control on the positioning in particular, but is it not a headache with lighting?
Not meaning to pry, but you mention your health; as a newcomer, I'm obviously still getting to know folks here so don't know everyone's history, but I take it you are implying a chronic illness rather than a short term problem? None of my business, I know - I have Crohn's disease which seems comparatively unknown but can leave me very uncomfortable at times. I work full time and have a long commute, plus two toddlers, so my time for cg is limited in the extreme (although signing up here has re-sparked my interest). I guess I asked about how much time you have for modelling as I don't know who on the forum is working full time, students or at home, etc - there's certainly a number of folks who seem to have producing a tremendous volume of work.
Anyway, keep up the good work, and thanks for the answers.
Hi Nez
Sorry to take so long getting back to you - my internet time has been severely curtailed of late. Tom has fortunately given a good technical reply to your question about background shaders V painting on a cube or plain (he's really good like that!). There are a couple of other things that using a cube can healp with - composition is a big one - you can scale and move the background to assist in composition and also the Fog foreground shader works more consistently with the painted image rather than the background shader.
You mention my health - no big secret there. I have permanently damaged tendons in both wrists and arms - possibly from too much chain sawing, hole digging and pole top work (working above your head) when I worked for the phone company, possible from too much cross-country motorcycle riding and possibly from playing the guitar for 35 odd years. What ever the cause my tendons are scarred and cause chronic pain and weakness in my arms. Additionally I also have a malfunctioning thyroid gland which leaves me at times feeling totally exhausted, short of breath and other things. I've had this for some time now although it was only diagnosed earlier this year.
I'm now on medication for my thyroid which has made a big difference to my general well being. That's probably too much info!! As to how much modelling and rendering I do in a week - the answer is: as much as possible and not as much as I'd like.
There is something about interactacting with an illusory 3 dimensional space that takes me out of myself. Whenever I'm using trueSpace and creating art (if I can call it that!) I'm usually so engrossed in the process that I don't notice the pain and discomfort - 3d is good therapy for me! (At least that's my excuse!).
As one of the last baby-boomers my kids are all grown up and living their own lives - so I just have to please myself and my wonderful partner. Having had toddlers, and full time work for most of my adult life I sympathise with your situation. Hopefully it may bring you some comfort to know that even with a reasonable amount of free time at my disposal I can never seem to get enough time to do all the modelling and art that I would like to!
HTH
Stephen |
Post by Nez // Oct 31, 2006, 3:26am
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Nez
Total Posts: 1102
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Thanks for the reply - I haven't been around the last week anyway, so I wouldn't have noticed the delay anyway! The tips for you and Tom on using background mattes looks very useful and I'll have to find some time to try that out. Also - thanks to Spacekdet for the skydome tutorial.
It's cool to hear that you find your computer time as therapy of a sort - with tendon damage, I'd be worrided that extensive keyboard/mouse time would aggravate the problem (like with carpal tunnel probelms etc), so I presume this isn't a major problem for you? My dad (who had hand problems because of MS) had to resort to a trackball for a while and eventually couldn't even manage with that which made computing very difficult. Anyway, I guess I'm veering off topic, so I'll simply wrap up with saying that I enjoy your work and that you (and of course others here) have inspired me to get back into truespace again assuming I can find some time! One day the kids will grow up and it'll be a bit quieter... :D |
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