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Look at my hairy Jackson!!!
About Truespace Archives
These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
Look at my hairy Jackson!!! // Image Gallery
Post by mrbones // May 26, 2007, 4:26pm
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mrbones
Total Posts: 1280
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Rich,
You said that improv would be better off just posting his artwork here and not at cgtalk. You also said its Caligari's job to market trueSpace and our job is just to have fun with it.
These sound more like influencing statements and not just opinions. Sorry if I misunderstood your opinions as suggesting statements. I did not say they were negative. I said they sounded IMHO, discouraging. and that I didnt understand what you meant.
Dont turn this into a fight, I was just expressing my own opinon of what I thought about your post. I really meant no harm and I think you are taking my comments way too personally.
I have never accused you of anything, yet you say always? Why are you painting me to be the bad guy?
Lighten up dude..
Cheers
Why is it you always are accusing me of things I am not saying? What exactly did I do to you that that feel you can tromp around putting words that I am not saying into a post?
I merely stated an opinion that other people have told me they have about TS... never did I mention the people here or any user of TS nor did I even imply it... And there is no negative message in that post. The best thing the TS community can do "IN MY Opinion" (and it is only my opinion) is to keep the forums here active and creative as they have been in the past and hopefully stay in the future. That is as strong a selling point as great software...
What you do for a living and money are no concern of mine...
Rich |
Post by RichLevy // May 26, 2007, 4:47pm
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RichLevy
Total Posts: 1140
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Rich,
You said that improv would be better off just posting his artwork here and not at cgtalk. You also said its Caligari's job to market trueSpace and our job is just to have fun with it.
These sound more like influencing statements and not just opinions. Sorry if I misunderstood your opinions as suggesting statements. I did not say they were negative. I said they sounded IMHO, discouraging. and that I didnt uderstand what you meant.
Dont turn this into a fight, I was just expressing my own opinon of what I thought about your post. I really meant no harm and I think you are taking my comments way too personally.
It's not a fight, nor do I have any desire to argue over this.
I'm trying to animate and enjoy what I am learning with TS and other software :D (notice the big smile).
I need to work on my messages, I think my sense of humor and whit do not come thru in my messages. I am not advertising gloom and doom. :cool: the future is so bright I gotta wear shades :cool:
Rich |
Post by prodigy // May 26, 2007, 4:55pm
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prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
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Someone wants an ice cream??? :D |
Post by mrbones // May 26, 2007, 5:08pm
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mrbones
Total Posts: 1280
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Someone wants an ice cream??? :D
ME Me, I want ICe cream!!
On a more serious note....
Rich,
Again sorry I did not appraise your post as humerous, perhaps I was just in a low mood, but I take all things Caligari, quite seriously. That is because my livelihood depends on the software that I choose to use to create salelable content.
I am very tired of the old notion that TrueSpace is just a toy and not a professional tool and I think the entire 3D/CG world is due for a very rude awakening on that front.
So that is why I responded to your post about just having fun with trueSpace, Beleive me I do have fun, but at the same time my livelihood(and others using TS for a living) is a very serious business as well. |
Post by kena // May 26, 2007, 8:07pm
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kena
Total Posts: 2321
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um.. you need to read that whole vote thread - at least THIS moderator was nicer about it. We're trying to cut back on the forums we have, and unless Truespace suddenly becomes an industry leader, it's not likely to show up in the list. Sorry. So I would say that Mr.Bones and company are the people who will get TS out there by making it a leader. People like myself, while haveing ProTeam membership will not be able to do much more than recomend it to friends. I'm just a "casual user" I chose TS because if it's interface. I like to do nice pictures that look 3d, and this program allows me to do so. |
Post by turumdarak // May 28, 2007, 7:25am
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turumdarak
Total Posts: 24
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Just a comment on the not having a trueSpace forum at CGTalk.
They had one when I first visited there years ago, but there was less than one post per week, maybe an average of one per month, I don't remember for sure, but that was the main reason that they got rid of it. |
Post by W!ZARD // May 28, 2007, 9:07am
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W!ZARD
Total Posts: 2603
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Firstly apologies to Madmouse - I didn't intend to provoke any dissension on your thread.:(
Secondly, my apologies to Improv as you seem to have interpreted my personal opinion as something other than I intended it. It would seem you have taken offence at my use of the word 'censorship' as you have twice referred to this aspect of my posts without addressing any of the other points I made.
I apologize if you think I was "letting off steam and bangin on" and "moaning and groaning" about this - it would seem I was unclear in my communication. My intent was to express my opinion in a calm and clear fashion - I believe I did that. I accept that my position may well be seen as a little extreme however I also believe that I can support my position with both logical reasoning and sound principles.
I believe your assertion that I was 'yelling censorship' is a bit strong. I further believe that the selective dissemination of any media is, by definition, censorship - which cgtalk clearly did when selecting against posting Madmouses art based on an arbitrary judgement.
You ask "why not go over there and express your opinion by voting for a TS forum." which is a fair and legitimate question and I believe I've already answered that. For the sake of clarity I will re-express my reasoning. I do not believe that cgtalk as a social and business entity operates on sound principles therefore I choose to withhold my support for them. (Incidentally I don't go to MacDonalds for much the same reason:D )
Expressing this metaphorically - given the choice between having a beer at a friendly and sociable bar and having a drink at an unfriendly, snobbish and unsociable bar.... well what would you choose?
Finally, with respect I would ask you to consider moderating your tone and selecting less emotive language. Phrases like "letting off steam and banging on here about this issue", "Yelling censorship as you have done....only serves to let off steam for you ", "moaning and groaning here.:rolleyes:" are based on your assumptions and are judgemental, disrespectful and unneccessary.
If you disagree with what I say, that is your choice and I respect that. If you wish to understand why I say the things I say, I am more than happy to explain myself further. I enjoy effective discussion and learning about other points of view - I do not enjoy being on the receiving end of emotive and derogatory language. That's why I DON'T go for a drinks at unfriendly bars ;)
Obviously-just like everyone else.
Instead of letting off steam and banging on here about this issue, go do something constructive over at CG Talk and work to change things. Yelling censorship as you have done does nothing to change things, but only serves to let off steam for you.
There is a request for a TS forum at CGTalk-why not go over there and express your opinion by voting for a TS forum. I know I already have.
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=155&t=481903
THAT would be a positive solution instead of moaning and groaning here.
:rolleyes: |
Post by roman // May 29, 2007, 12:51pm
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roman
Total Posts: 320
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It is Caligari's job to promote the software... your's is to have fun with it :D RichBut how else can we promote the software other than showing excellent artwork which TS users created? |
Post by kena // May 29, 2007, 1:20pm
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kena
Total Posts: 2321
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Well... I suppose that you could always try to sell it on the odd street corner. Or, with a slight amendment to your submission permission form....
You could find and submit the month's winner into other contests :D |
Post by 3dvisuals dude // May 29, 2007, 1:42pm
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3dvisuals dude
Total Posts: 1703
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But how else can we promote the software other than showing excellent artwork which TS users created?
Hi Roman,
I realize you put that question to Rich and it is an excellent idea to promote the new TS7.5 capabilities in other forums wherever possible. Your question gave me one additional idea though, and maybe you'll like it.:confused:
I see TS7.5 as more than just a great toolset to create fantastic images and animations, it can also produce some truly amazing 3D Models for realworld re-creation via STL output.
What if, for instance, Caligari made us all the following offer?
Each of you [us] create 3 unique 3D Sculpture Models with a single plain textured render for each and send them all to Caligari within 2 weeks.
After 2 weeks they would all be reviewed by Caligari and Caligari would select as many or as few of them as they alone decide, have them processed via STL for realworld prototyping, and use the collection of realworld models at various realworld Caligari promotions and events.
You could even reproduce the prototypes in huge scale for styrofoam reproductions if you liked for outdoor displays and events!
Each finished realworld product could be mounted on an inexpensive and simple pedestal with a small plaque stating "Created with trueSpace 7.5 3D Authoring Software and Donated to Caligari by a Dedicated Customer."
Just a thought...
Now I apologize to Madmouse for getting off topic here and return you all to focus on his truly GREAT Sam Jackson model. ;)
- 3dvisuals dude |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 29, 2007, 1:45pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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Hey congrats to Madmouse, Hairy Jackson is now enshrined in the Captain's Blog :banana:
-Jack. |
Post by 3dvisuals dude // May 29, 2007, 2:03pm
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3dvisuals dude
Total Posts: 1703
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Hairy Jackson in the Captains Blog!!! :D
Excellent, and clearly Roman knows talent when he sees it ! ;)
Congratulations Madmouse... well deserved recognition indeed.
- 3dvisuals dude |
Post by RichLevy // May 29, 2007, 2:13pm
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RichLevy
Total Posts: 1140
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But how else can we promote the software other than showing excellent artwork which TS users created?
It's tough when the big boss questions your comments.
The original reply was whether users should try to push CGTalk into putting up a TrueSpace forum. I have seen this one other time, inevitably the CGTalk reply is to give them a small space and see what the users will do with it, so far I have watched it die due to lack of participation. Is that good publicity for your software?
Look at Renderosity, a very active board, at one time the TS section had a decent amount of activity also... not so much now... Is that a good way to promote your software?
By keeping the best user's focused here they are answering questions, they are providing assistance and encouragement to new and old user's alike. They are producing the art that you use in your promotions as it is... A circle the wagons kind of mentality maybe, but new and potential user's can easily come here and get a response from any one of the users or a Caligari employee. That is worth a lot to someone who wants to be doing things in 3D but feels they may need some hand holding while they learn.
My full statements meaning is from the above, the snippet you quoted is my own personal way of doing things, don't get in an uproar about little things, fight the big battles (and win :) ) and let the little ones go. Enjoy the software and have fun... nothing too deep in the meaning of that.
So far in the last week I have voiced my opinion in 2 separate threads here... I don't think my voice is much appreciated or wanted :D I'll refrain from further opinions in the future... (less talk, more WIPs)
Rich |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 29, 2007, 4:37pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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I also agree with Rich. There are even times when the forum here is slow, but on other sites it ends up being a ghostland. It's embarrassing and discouraging having a forum on a professional site and no one posting. I definitely think it's better for TS users to uses these forums for TS related things.
But there's nothing wrong with using other forums for WIPs and displaying our work just like is done with any other software. I just think that where blatant evangelism isn't going to be well received, good artwork can increase interest.
Also it's not really fair to put TS work in a situation where it has to compete with works produced by industry leaders using Maya and Max. TS has made great strides but its still not on that level yet and doesn't have that kind of established industry userbase. On the otherhand with XSI now in TS's price range TS has much to prove.
I think training vids like what Nowherebrain is working on are an awesome way for new users to see TS in action and how it might fit into their workflow. I think workflow is the key thing that Caligari needs to keep in mind as the new architecture is developed further.
So far Caligari is the first of the of the major 3D companies to get their core re-write done. So they're ahead the curve on that, hopefully that will translate into a chance to be a major player again.
-Jack |
Post by MadMouse // May 29, 2007, 9:16pm
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MadMouse
Total Posts: 1069
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WoooHooo!! the captain's blog:banana: Now I only need an Oscar, an Emmy and a purple heart and I've got the set:D
Seriously... Thanks for the kind words in your blog Roman. It's always nice to know that the big dog appreciates what your doing. |
Post by roman // May 29, 2007, 10:24pm
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roman
Total Posts: 320
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By keeping the best user's focused here they are answering questions, they are providing assistance and encouragement to new and old user's alike.This is absolutely true and we intend to make this Forum better than ever, you will see further improvements with truePlace2.0 in not too distant future.
At the same time I feel that this is the moment to evangelize, to bring more members to our comunity from outside. We can do that if we show them TS7.5 real time pre-viz capabilities, Link Editor, Script Editor, Character Editor, Animation Editor, collaboration etc.
Jack Edwards said that so far Caligari is the first of the of the major 3D companies to get their core re-write done. That is true and we do not want to sit and wait until Maya and 3DS will come up with their next generation architecture, we want to press our advantage now. |
Post by weaveribm // May 30, 2007, 12:09am
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weaveribm
Total Posts: 592
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...how else can we promote the software other than showing excellent artwork which TS users created?
3D Authoring and Collaborating...
Commission a group of professional/talented users to create something wonderful? Something along the lines of-
Alice In Wonderland/Through The Looking Glass (but change the names to similar names)
Gullivers Travels (but change the name to a similar name and make him female)
King Kong (but change the name to a similar name: as in the 'Konga' movie)
Moby Dick (but change the name to a similar name) (great seascapes in here)
-and other illustrations for important books? Call them 'tributes' to get around copyright problems.
Jennifer's Travels, Alison's Adventures and so on. 'Scenes To Capture The Imagination'
Peter |
Post by parva // May 30, 2007, 12:34am
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parva
Total Posts: 822
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So far Caligari is the first of the of the major 3D companies to get their core re-write done.
Lightwave has also nearly completed her core in Ligtwave9.x and not to forget Cinema4d.
The problem is that there are competitors out there which are (currently) for trueSpace unbeatable.
Not just from features side but also stability. Just take a look at Modo.
Another fact is that the times where one program was good for everything are over. |
Post by roman // May 30, 2007, 10:52am
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roman
Total Posts: 320
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Lightwave has also nearly completed her core in Ligtwave9.x Hmm I thought that Modo was in fact Lightwave core rewrite, Lighwave guys must be very talented to be producing these core rewrites with such ease, it took us 5 years:) |
Post by Misc // May 30, 2007, 7:00pm
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Misc
Total Posts: 59
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Lightwave and Modo are two different Applikations.
As far as I know, Newtek began to rewrite their core mid/end 2004.
Luxology was foundet 2001. Modo was released in September 2004 with a complete new core called Nexus. |
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