free 3d servers and 3d viewer clients and free hosting of 3d worlds

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free 3d servers and 3d viewer clients and free hosting of 3d worlds // Collaboration

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Post by notejam // Jan 17, 2008, 6:28am

notejam
Total Posts: 191
There is a free 3d server with voice chat at [URL="http://www.digitalspace.com/products/dss.html"]http://www.digitalspace.com/products/dss.html[/URL

And a Free client to view the 3d worlds and participate in 3d voice chat at http://www.digitalspace.com/traveler/startpage.html


The server allows scriptiing of 3d scenes in python, and allows user animated avitars. It looks like a real easy server to install, not much to do to run it. Nasa makes use of it for some of their simulation testing.


Also you can have your 3d world hosted for free at http://techworlds.org/


They already host about 200 3d worlds there, so you might want to get the traveler 3d client and go there and have some 3d fun.


You can download another free client that lets you access another set of 3d worlds at http://www.mediamachines.com/developer.php


They also have flux studio, a free 3d world maker, that has provision to add proximity detectors to 3d world items, etc.

It creates worlds that can be viewed by the viewer client, for multi user 3d chat worlds. It has a import truespace section, and I imported truespace obj files, scene files, and characters from the truespace library into it ok, I think. At least the mesh got there ok. I really need someone to test this and see if there are any problems with the truespace import files or not.

When you import scenes or characters, you do have to change the file type on the browser file window to all files before you can see any of the truespace scene files, or character files. It does seem to convert polygon objects and scenes or characters into nurbs equivlants. It seems to be a pretty good tool to get with all the file conversions it can do, you could load in truespace files, and export them into lots of other formats.


Flux studio can ftp the files you imported from truespace to your website, and give a link so your world appears on the server.

This is nice -- YOU DO NOT EVEN NEED A SERVER to serve truespace 3d worlds from your web page! You and your web site visitors will need to download and install the free flux 3d client to make use of this.


Flux studio supports some type of script. It seems to be jscript to me, but I do not know the language enough yet to be certain about that, so scripters, check it out, ok?


Blaxxun has a free 3d world viewer that gives you access to yet another set of 3d worlds. Get it at http://www.blaxxun.com

Of all the interfaces to a 3d world, I liked this one the best. Some neat features. Right click on a 3d world view when visiting with this 3d browser gives you an option to change viewpoint. Most worlds have a set of view points set up and that list appears in this option window. You can click on any of them, and immediately be there. Another nice feature is you have the option to fly, and also turn off collision detetcion. With collision detection off you can just go right through the walls of buildings, etc. You do not need to find a door. This is also especially good when you get stuck in a place thats hard to get out of, and its good for entering places that have difficult entrys due to poor design.

Flying allows you to enter upper levels that can be hard to find the path to get there. It also usually has a tour or two, if you click that , your avatar moves through the scene on the programed tour, making it easy to learn the layout of a new place.


I think you will really enjoy the 3d worlds there. I also like the big chat window on the bottom half of the screen, that optionally can be turned off, if you just want to see the 3d world. Its nice to not have to drag and reposition a chat window every visit. I would like trueplay in the future to have some of this type of interface as it makes it easy. I find it much easier to figure out what to do, when the items have words, rather than just icons for navigation.

Post by Scala3D // Jan 17, 2008, 8:13am

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Cool, Notejam. Thanks for the info. I will go check these out.

Post by 3dvisuals dude // Jan 17, 2008, 8:38am

3dvisuals dude
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Interesting stuff Notejam.

If you want to see the ultimate in freebie 3D virtual experience though you will need to go to Entropia Universe.

http://www.entropiauniverse.com/index.var

They are transitioning to the CryEngine2 Gaming Engine at the moment, and the quality of it all there is breathtaking.

Still, even with all the cool things to do in places like Second Life, ActiveWorlds, Entropia Universe, There, Kaneva, and a host of others like the ones you found above I will definitely stay with trueSpace and trueServe and truePlay for my own uses and objectives in the years ahead as opposed to any of these other virtual world models simply because of the facts that as a trueSpace designer the future is here, not there, and as an Investor the future is here too, since only trueServe, out of all these virtual world models offers Investors absolute control over their entire virtual world and their entire virtual business model in every detail, especially in regard to the return on their investments.

As a user only though, sure... go with the most powerful ones you can get into free, why not! That would be Entropia Universe for sure... nothing else comes even close at the moment in any way at all.

- 3dvisuals dude

Post by notejam // Jan 17, 2008, 9:54am

notejam
Total Posts: 191
Thanks for posting that. Wow, there are a lot of fantasitc 3d artists working on that place, really pretty. I also think trueplay will become better in new upgrades, and truespace7.5 is already fantastic. My intent is not to detract from shared space but instead just share some things that will be of value in solving some problems that we have right now, but I expect will soon be cured in future upgrades of trueplay, and shared space, such as the audio chat feature. Also the free server allows persons to develope applications that will be private if they wish, which is sometimes better than a current shared space where anyone can drop in and do anything, which might accidently shut what your trying to develope down. It also allows the person that does not have much money to set up their own 3d world and test it out, without intrusions by others if they wish.


I am hoping that shared space will eventually have links to other worlds like this entropiauniverse site, and then eu will have in its worlds a return link to truespace worlds. 3d worlds could become much bigger, much faster if we could get different worlds linked up like this, and as long as the user had the correct browsers installed, the link would just open another window, start the correct 3d browser for that link, so to the user, the switch from one universe to the next would occur smoothly. They would only need to learn to navigate in what ever controls each 3d browser presented to them.


The tools such as faux studio, do some things that are good for utilitys to get other ojects, models, scenes, rapidly into other file formats that can then be imported into truespace7.5, and also does some graphic conversions that may prove usefull, in other words, it gives us extended tools since it will load truespace 7.5 things. Also I think the post is of value to our developers and I hope they will take a look at some of this, and maybe add some of these things to truespace7.5 and trueplay.

Post by Délé // Jan 17, 2008, 11:02am

Délé
Total Posts: 1374
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The spaces online right now are just for tS users to share and learn with. They are not meant to be the only use of shared spaces at all. Just one small example.

With trueServe you can build your own 3d worlds and have complete control over who is allowed in, if they're allowed to use trueSpace to enter or only truePlay, etc. So instead of using someone else's servers (which is free to some extent, but also limited in ways) you can have your own which you have complete control over. You can charge people to enter if you wish, set it up for business, etc. I definitely think there are things that can be done with other 3d worlds that can be fun and useful, but if you want/need complete control over your worlds trueServe/truePlay is the only thing out there that lets you do that. There are definitely markets where this is better then using any of the online game worlds.

http://www.caligari.com/Products/trueSpace/tServe/tServe_intro.asp

We are also supposed to be getting rentable spaces sometime (hopefully soon). In those spaces we would have more control of things as well. We could have private spaces where only we can change things and stuff.

TruePlay is definitely still developing. Roman said that fully articulated avatars are on the way as are other advancements to be sure. I'm certain that there are many companies out there (perhaps even NASA like you mentioned) that would be interested in having "complete" control over their online virtual environments, and trueServe would be appealing to them. Probably more so then the other online 3d worlds out there.

Post by 3dvisuals dude // Jan 18, 2008, 4:13am

3dvisuals dude
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I am hoping that shared space will eventually have links to other worlds like this entropiauniverse site, and then eu will have in its worlds a return link to truespace worlds. 3d worlds could become much bigger, much faster if we could get different worlds linked up like this, and as long as the user had the correct browsers installed, the link would just open another window, start the correct 3d browser for that link, so to the user, the switch from one universe to the next would occur smoothly. They would only need to learn to navigate in what ever controls each 3d browser presented to them.


Have you ever seen a commercial on the television showing a new concept that is being sold worldwide and it is incredibly popular... but it is an idea that you yourself had a few years back and now someone else is making tens of millions of dollars a year off exactly the same idea you had?

You could set up a trueServe server of your own to do exactly what you are describing here and sell access to that service to Second Life, ActiveWorlds, Entropia Universe, There, Kaneva, and at least a dozen other global Virtual World Hosting Companies for a fortune in lease money every single year.

No one is doing that yet and you could definitely set up a "Multiverse Virtual World Membership Exchange" to introduce the tens of millions of members in each of these worlds to each other world free of charge, while being paid very very well by the many virtual world hosts for broadening their marketshares.

Remember I told you that.... if you don't do it someone will for sure sooner or later and they could retire in Tahiti the very same year they do!

Great idea there guy.... read what Emerson said about personal ideas in his essay on "Self Reliance," it could change your life in very good ways.;)

A man should learn to detect and watch that gleam of light which flashes across his mind from within, more than the lustre of the firmament of bards and sages. Yet he dismisses without notice his thought, because it is his. In every work of genius we recognize our own rejected thoughts: they come back to us with a certain alienated majesty.
http://www.emersoncentral.com/selfreliance.htm (http://www.emersoncentral.com/selfreliance.htm)

- 3dvisuals dude

Post by notejam // Jan 18, 2008, 7:41am

notejam
Total Posts: 191
I am wondering if the truespace server has the option to limit scripts to server side only? In other words, no one could come into the world and start installing scripts, so the only scripts that would ever run would be those installed by the person making the world. The potential problem I see, is that if one puts a link to a truespace server on a web page, anyone can view the source code of that web page, and obtain the link, and thus have the server address. Then if they ever decide to use truespace to visit that server, they can come in with scripts already installed on their system and running that end up getting installed on the server and all other visitors visiting in truespace which is risky. Yes they have to give their password, but it seems to me there is a need to be able to detect if they are entering with truespace, or trueplay, and forbid entry with truespace if desired, and also have a second option where they are allowed to enter with truespace, but not run any scripts, add any scripts to the scene etc.

And then another option where they can come with truespace, and grab the scene if they want, but they can not do any edits or repositioning of scenes/objects.


We need to have options where we can limit what the visitor can do and have several levels of priviledes be able to be set for the world, in order to prevent accidental damage to the scenes, and or damage caused by them entering with scripts which can be caused if the visitor goes to the room with truespace, rather than trueplay.


So I believe the server needs to be able to set the following options:


Suggested Vistior Priveledges Options.

Visit with truespace ON, OFF

Visit with truespace and run scripts ON, OFF

Visit with truespace and edit objects/scenes ON, OFF

Visit with truespace and create own scenes/ojbects ON, OFF

Visit with truespace and view but not download scenes/objects ON, OFF


These options could be set by the person that made the 3d world.

Anyone have any other options to add to the list?

I do not think any user wouild do intentional damage, since their password would be in the server log, and they could be identified, but currently there seems to me to be risks of accidental damage, not being able to retain rights to objects and scenes you make because anyone can come in with truespace and grab them, etc., and these issues need to be addressed and solved.

Post by frootee // Jan 18, 2008, 8:22am

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You are preaching to the choir notejam. These issues have been raised already. :) Glad you're thinking about these issues too!

Post by TomG // Jan 18, 2008, 9:55am

TomG
Total Posts: 3397
Finding a server address does you no good :)


First, you will need to have a userid and password on that server. Having signed up with Caligari for truePlay will NOT give you access to someone else's server - that will have its own list of password and userids controlled by the server admin.


Next, the server as it is today is already capabale of specifying whether users are allowed in with tS or tP. It is possible already to create rooms where folks can only come in with tP, or certain folks can only come in with tP. We don't do this on the Caligari servers, as they are public places so anyone can log in with tP or tS, but the capability is there. This would make it impossible for people to upload objects if the space didnt allow tS in, of course - then only the server admin (or other selected people) could come in and make changes.


Again this stops unauthorised people coming in and saving your objects via tS - entry is specified per "world" so if you planned on sharing objects, eg say with the design department where you would collaborate, but you want marketing and sales to see the object, but not to be able to copy it, and you want no-one outside the company to come in at all, then you can set up just that kind of access.


If you wanted only one person to be able to show objects, and no-one else to be able to save them, then that is possible too, just make only one person have access via tS.


So most of these concerns are already built in to how things work - just that the only example people have currently visited is the rather unusual example of Caligari's own servers, where we enable everyone to openly edit things and allow everyone access via tS.


Our server is configured that way as that makes sense for our company - not because it is the only way the server can be configured :)


HTH!

Tom

Post by Délé // Jan 18, 2008, 10:10am

Délé
Total Posts: 1374
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As I mentioned above, the ability to limit access to truePlay only is already implemented. So the first one on your list can be crossed off. That alone adds a LOT of security. When people can only log into a space with tP, they can't alter geometry, move objects (if you have them locked), drop scripts in, or run scripts (unless you have it set up so they can).

So just restricting visitor use to truePlay makes it very secure and is possible right now. I don't even see the need to let others log in with tS in nearly any real world scenario. In most scenarios, visitors would only be allowed to log in with tP. The only instance that I can think of where it's really useful to log in with tS is the Caligari spaces where we can share knowledge and techniques. That and possibly in a 3d pipeline where multiple people are assembling a scene or animation, but that may be better on an intranet, which is possible to do too.

With trueServe you can also decide if people can log in with tS or tP individually. So you can let some of your coworkers log in with tS to help you with the scene, but everyone else can only log in with tP.

Edit: Looks like Tom beat me to it. First he's faster then me in the speed modeling contest, now he's posting faster then me. I just can't win. :p

Post by Scala3D // Jan 18, 2008, 11:14am

Scala3D
Total Posts: 157
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Interesting, does the TS manual talk about locking objects? I would like to learn more?

Post by TomG // Jan 18, 2008, 11:22am

TomG
Total Posts: 3397
Hi Scala,


You can only lock objects in the scene as a server admin, which is a trueServe item, rather than a trueSpace item so is not covered in the trueSpace manual. It's used to define which objects are part of the static background of the scene, so that even when folks can come in with trueSpace and start creating, they can't delete the floor or walls or whatever other permanent objects you want to define the environment.


But as noted, that's all trueServe, no-one except Caligari has that capability on our servers so you won't find mention of it in the manual. Now if you would like to purchase your own server, we can go into as much detail as you like about such admin functions :)


And lol Dele on the speed modeling and speed forum typing :) Forum replies are my speciality! For the speed modeling, I just got lucky though!


HTH!

Tom

Post by Délé // Jan 18, 2008, 12:29pm

Délé
Total Posts: 1374
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What Tom mentioned is likely the best way, but if you're setting up a scene for truePlay users only, you can also expand the matrix for all of the objects that you want to be static. With the matrix expanded you can not move, scale, or rotate an object with the widget. So it essentially locks the objects for people using truePlay.

Post by TomG // Jan 18, 2008, 12:31pm

TomG
Total Posts: 3397
Aha, clever idea that one. While not fully locking the object, eg those with tS can still get in and change it around, it will provide a quick and easy way to limit accidental moving of objects by visitors with tP :)


Thanks!

Tom

Post by 3dvisuals dude // Jan 18, 2008, 8:39pm

3dvisuals dude
Total Posts: 1703
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Notejam,

While the other virtual world servers out there are nice and some are free, and while at first glance a trueServe lease may seem a bit steep for the average user here, there is something to take into consideration in all this that is defintely worth mentioning here in this context.

Caligari's existing truePlaces are run on trueServe and use at the moment 12 public portals.

Now you only need one portal on your own trueServe hosted server to start the business you suggested above by yourself, and could lease out the other eleven. (Assuming of course that you don't wish to lease out more than eleven.)

If you already have the hardware and dedicated phone line to adequately run a server, or if you lease those both through ServerBeach http://www.serverbeach.com/, and you then entered into a trueServe lease with Caligari, and you immediately leased out the 11 portals which you wouldn't be needing or using yourself, then you would have not only your own free portal where you could start and run your own global business(es) you would also in effect have more income from your eleven leased portals than all the expenditures involved in the server, the trueServe lease, and the phone line combined.

This way your trueServe lease investment could very easily provide you with an immediate and very cost-effective profit.

If you do this though, be sure to tell Roman that I gave you the idea.:D

trueServe can definitely make plenty of dollars and sense.:)

- 3dvisuals dude

Post by Scala3D // Jan 19, 2008, 8:29am

Scala3D
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Thanks Tom for the information on "locking objects".

Post by notejam // Jan 19, 2008, 10:08pm

notejam
Total Posts: 191
Whats reasonable for phone lines for portals? Would 12 portals run ok on one dsl line? , or would more dsl lines be needed? And thanks everyone for your replys regarding server questions I had.

Post by 3dvisuals dude // Jan 20, 2008, 1:08am

3dvisuals dude
Total Posts: 1703
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Whats reasonable for phone lines for portals? Would 12 portals run ok on one dsl line? , or would more dsl lines be needed? And thanks everyone for your replys regarding server questions I had.

Well, there's a lot of factors that go into all this in relation to the phone line used depending on how you wish to use the server mainly, as well as what various line options may cost in your particular location or through your desired hardware host service, if you choose to use one.

T3 Lines are the best and the fastest, they are also the most expensive, and they are not always easy to get a lease to in many locations worldwide, including here in the US. ServerBeach uses them exclusively now I believe (but check with them on that to be certain), whereas they used to offer a choice of T1 Line or a T3 Line upgrade, I'm not sure if they still do that.

I've never had a "DSL Line" so I have no idea what the performance is on that nor what the limitations of that may be, so if you are thinking of using that I'd recommend a lot of research into it before investing in anything else related to a global multi-user server.

A T3 line, for instance can handle 256 simultaneous users, not that you'd be likely to have that many simultaneous users unless you were hosting a genuinely massive and hugely popular global virtual world, but as for me I plan to go that way just to have the very best line money can buy and the peace of mind that comes with.

Here's a quick look at the definitions of T1 and T3 lines:

http://www.webopedia.com/TERM/T/T_1_carrier.html

http://www.webopedia.com/TERM/T/T_3_carrier.htm

As for the "DSL Line" you mentioned I have no idea about it's capabilities so you may want to call your provider and get clarification on that as well as info on whatever else they may offer while you are at it.

There are many hardware service host providers such as ServerBeach out there with various levels of capability and costs. I did about six months of research into that for my own planned needs and determined that the very best option across the board is to simply use ServerBeach, they are inexpensive, extremely reliable, extremely competent, extremely flexible, and their reputation after many years in the game is absolutely superb.

As for me, I'd rather let someone else such as ServerBeach handle all of that for me than do it myself, but that's your choice as well of course.

Any way you slice it though, the world is very much ready now to partake in virtual world experiences, businesses, and services like never before. If you have vision and determination you can go far with it all very quickly.:)

- 3dvisuals dude
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