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Booleans Bug (model side and workspace side) please help me!

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Booleans Bug (model side and workspace side) please help me! // Bugs

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Post by ivampretti // Sep 17, 2008, 7:28am

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I've detected a bug in booleans operations in both sides of TS. the first image its a plane and a series of solids for make the holes in the plane! I need this shape urgent!!! it does work of any kind of metods, I tried with nurbs with solids with groups of solids and the boolean, nothing works!!!


1- model plane with the solids

2- model solid (plane with boolean substraction of the solids)

3- the solid rendered (where are the holes???)

4- solid view in WS

Post by robert // Sep 17, 2008, 9:21am

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Ah yes boolean errors, did you subtract the objects one at a time or in a group?

Post by hultek43 // Sep 17, 2008, 10:36am

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You could try quad dividing those faces a couple times that will get the holes and see if that helps.

Post by ivampretti // Sep 17, 2008, 10:59am

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I tried with group, with encapsulate and making a boolean add of the objects, but I'm lasy to try one at a time:D:D:D I'll try quad divid the surface now, this I didn't try yeat!

Post by jamesmc // Sep 17, 2008, 11:05am

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I always did multiple booleans with a vector program like Illustrator or Xara Xtreme, Inkscape(must use eps with this program), etc. One main reason it is easier and I can align precisely where the cuts are without too much hassle.

Then I export as a legacy AI file and import into trueSpace Modeler as an object. Be sure to group your object in the vector program before it is exported.

You can extrude out the flat object as necessary.

Post by ivampretti // Sep 17, 2008, 11:26am

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well, one at a time and quad divid both not work! it looks that it just do 6 holes...

Jamesmc this programs are free? I never use any other program with the truespace. Except in a few days ago I was tring to communication with AutoCad and Microstation with the dxf format, but both don't do a nice job....

Post by jamesmc // Sep 17, 2008, 11:30am

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well, one at a time and quad divid both not work! it looks that it just do 6 holes...
Jamesmc this programs are free? I never use any other program with the truespace. Except in a few days ago I was tring to communication with AutoCad and Microstation with the dxf format, but both don't do a nice job....

Inkscape is free, the other two, Illustrator and Xtreme cost money.

Post by jamesmc // Sep 17, 2008, 11:51am

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On second look, it appears you didn't have enough quad divisions to do the task. Notice the wire outlines of the quads on the plane. It takes quite a bit because you are doing a complex Boolean operation.

Before and after Boolean workspace side. HTH

Edit: I didn't take the time to align everything, just for demonstration purposes.

Post by ivampretti // Sep 17, 2008, 11:57am

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but you tried with the rounded cubes? I dont know if this is the problem, becase rounded cubes are very much more complex, but I'll take a look!

Post by robert // Sep 17, 2008, 12:00pm

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I made the lattice-work below by making columns of cubes then subtracting one column at a time in workspace, and no problems.:confused: The wireframe looks exactly the same, no edges anywhere except around holes and edges of the object.


Hooray for Délé's scripts, linemup and copier.:banana:


Admittedly I did everything mathematically with exact number values, not sure that makes a difference though.:rolleyes:


Decided to attach the object for inspection

Post by robert // Sep 17, 2008, 12:10pm

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I've gotten the error before, a long time ago, but can't seem to replicate it even when using a plane with no divisions and randomly subtracted cubes. Not sure why yours doesn't work.:(

Post by jamesmc // Sep 17, 2008, 12:14pm

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but you tried with the rounded cubes? I dont know if this is the problem, becase rounded cubes are very much more complex, but I'll take a look!

Well, I tried rounded cubes with no problems. If you have enough quad divide, it appears you can make whatever design you want on the plane.

My distorted smiley face with Boolean.

Post by ivampretti // Sep 17, 2008, 12:23pm

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I think I discovered the problem. I you tri to do this in the model side it's impossible to do, in the workspace funciont ok, but when you turn on the bridge is when starts the problems! How could I render this in the model side? because if in the first time it works well in model side, when you close and get back to TS it get crazy again....

Post by robert // Sep 17, 2008, 12:24pm

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I had the bridge on while doing mine, I had no problems... Strange.

Post by ivampretti // Sep 17, 2008, 12:34pm

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you tried to render in the model side? now I'm trying it is working just to embarass me :D:D:D but the real time render in model side its still crazy, I dont know, I spend 24h trying to do this and it doesnt worked! Now its partial working... yeah really strange!!!

Post by robert // Sep 17, 2008, 12:38pm

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Works in model render look.

Post by robert // Sep 17, 2008, 12:43pm

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Is your bridge set to auto or on? Mine's on auto, don't know if that would make any difference.

Post by ivampretti // Sep 17, 2008, 12:45pm

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Nop, back dont working again! hum yeah, the mine is in the On mode, let me try with the auto!

Post by ivampretti // Sep 17, 2008, 1:19pm

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HU! looks like it is working with the bridge turned on! Not 100% but in the rendering with lightworks is ok! but the real time in model side still crazy... I'll try do it again with the auto bridge.

Post by jamesmc // Sep 17, 2008, 1:32pm

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HU! looks like it is working with the bridge turned on! Not 100% but in the rendering with lightworks is ok! but the real time in model side still crazy... I'll try do it again with the auto bridge.


Here's a render in lightworks, a quickie cartoon looking building, utilizing a glass shader plane for the windows behind the Boolean wall.

Looks okay on the Workspace side as well, just need to use different shaders.

Post by ivampretti // Sep 17, 2008, 1:44pm

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what you mean with different shaders? I still did not used shaders...

Post by robert // Sep 17, 2008, 1:47pm

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what you mean with different shaders? I still did not used shaders...


He means if you were to use shaders they may not necessarily transfer between model and workspace, and just to be aware of that.

Post by rrf // Sep 17, 2008, 2:50pm

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I don't know if this will help, but I noticed that in your original booleaned model, the holes were not connected to any of the side edges. Try exporting the model as .x (the .x format) - then re-import, it will be triangulated, but I think it may automatically fix the problem.


hth,


rf

Post by robert // Sep 17, 2008, 2:54pm

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I don't know if this will help, but I noticed that in your original booleaned model, the holes were not connected to any of the side edges. Try exporting the model as .x (the .x format) - then re-import, it will be triangulated, but I think it may automatically fix the problem.


hth,


rf


That would do it yeah, good back up plan if things go wrong.

Post by TomG // Sep 18, 2008, 2:30am

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Or use Quadrify Polygons, which will ensure you don't have floating edges / faces. Or manually triangulate. (See recent discussion last week on holes, booleans, export, and triangulation!)


HTH!

Tom

Post by tomasb // Sep 18, 2008, 4:42am

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the problem you describe is caused by modeler real time triangulator used for rendering and bridge. It fails to triangulate more complex shapes and as wS works internally with triangles it messes things up. This happens also for shapes generated in wS when you modify them in modeler - they get converted to polygons and then retriangulated with bad triangulator... The trick is to quadrify more complicated polygons in wS then modeler triangulation works.

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