Unofficial Newsletter from Steinie

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These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.

They are retained here for archive purposes only.

Unofficial Newsletter from Steinie // Ambassador's Club

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Post by Steinie // Sep 19, 2008, 4:21am

Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
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TrueSpace Forum Membership is doing alright with an increase of 277% since last year. See what happens when you see the word FREE?

Active Members increased 31.8% over the same time period.

The bad news is Active Members are dropping by 30% since last Month.

I don't have a clue what causes decline. I do know that trying to explain TS7.6 to a new user just coming in would be a nightmare... What's this Bridge thing? Two programs? NO render engine in workSpace?

For those asking Caligari the status of the "Patch" I would suggest the longer we let them fix things the better. The next release might be a long ways off. Just think of all the things needed in TS8 for them to eliminate that bridge.

Also remember to ask tons of questions now because once the Patch comes out Caligari closes down like a Clam. Most of the top Forum users disappear into the "Other Forum" with tape across their mouths.

You won't be seeing my work in the Gallery anytime soon. My gripes about the Gallery still stands. When it becomes fair then I'll enter. Right now it is like a 4H fair and I've been presenting my Cow into a Horse Show.

I really truly didn't think my work had value here until Nez posted proof otherwise, thanks Nez. (I got the message)

I think the MMC group has finally figured out why the submissions dropped this month. Please reread my post right after the Subject was given in this months MMC regarding similar Challenges causes a drop in interest.

Has anyone noticed the Screen shots in the SMC? Does ANYONE use the workSpace side?! Just an observation since I do.

One of my backgrounds is in Advertising and probably the reason they awarded me an Ambassador title. When I see something great I draw attention to it. Look at trueBlues light fix going from 3 downloads to 38. After you make people aware of the product and aware of it's benefits will the demand for it increase. It was a great addition to trueSpace but getting lost in the traffic.
I don't see any of that being done with VE. I checked here and I checked the Microsofty sites. They both have to do a better job getting the message out, describe it's benefits, and then offer support. Only then will the user base and participation increase.

Here is a tip for those trying to win VRay...enter your stuff into VE! The odds are very good someone will win it there. All those castles were a no brainer.

I like to look at trends. I predicted the release of tS7.6 within 20 minutes of it happening. No one tells me anything around here so don't think I'm being tipped off. My gut tells me we will be getting a new truePlay when the Patch is released. We'll see if I'm right.

Roman has already hinted about surprises.

Post by parva // Sep 19, 2008, 5:58am

parva
Total Posts: 822
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I do know that trying to explain TS7.6 to a new user just coming in would be a nightmare...

And thats one of the BIG problems. Free or not trueSpace 7 quality and use is low.
No offence even I tried many times to include tS into my working pipeline
but in fact there are programs out there that do the job better and much easier.

The workspace viewing engine is one of the things which have in my eyes the greatest potential like the LE
but for now it's just eyecandy give-away.
The whole program workflow is terrible in my eyes.
I could now begin to explain but I'm tired to speak against walls :D

I really hope that truespace gets the turn but that needs A LOT of work to do...

my 2 cents ^^

Post by Steinie // Sep 19, 2008, 6:21am

Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
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Parva, to me your the "BEST" artist using the workSpace side. If they don't even listen to you how would we expect them to listen to us?

You have to make them think it is THEIR idea then it might change.:rolleyes:

I have heard your frustration before and it is really a pity the lack of value they show towards the knowledgeable, experienced and gifted trueSpace artist like yourself.

Frootee started a WorkFlow Problem thread here:
http://forums1.caligari.com/truespace/showthread.php?t=6734

Post by frootee // Sep 19, 2008, 6:22am

frootee
Total Posts: 2667
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thanks for the newsletter Steinie. Interesting points.


Why the drop in active members? Perhaps people aren't getting answers they need; perhaps lack of activity and 'excitement' in the forums to keep them coming back.

As for myself, I've been working 'behind the curtain' and have not been too active on the forums. Hopefully that will change soon.... bring an umbrella and flood pants! ... :D


Regarding workflow... I'll start a thread in the Feature Discussion forum, since it sounds like this is a serious issue.


Froo

Post by splinters // Sep 19, 2008, 8:17am

splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Am I being cynical or is the drop simply because people became members to get some quick help for their free program then either got bored waiting or decided that, free or not, tS was not for them?


Seems likely....:o


P.S Regarding workflow. I tried to introduce tS to a class today and found myself repeating the same things about the bridge, model side, hidden icons etc. etc.


I got frustrated because it all seems so natural to me. These were bright kids...they just didn't get it. Perhaps it belies logic and therefore they cannot understand why anyone would 'do that'. Either way, I have to rethink how I teach the program.


Workflow is an issue and the UI needs work. I did once submit a proposal for a UI...perhaps I will post it here as it belongs to no-one...just a bit of an experiment.


Perhaps a new thread devoted to tS8 UI....

Post by RichLevy // Sep 19, 2008, 9:20am

RichLevy
Total Posts: 1140
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When the free version came out I made sure a group of digital artist I am a member of were re-introduced to it again (many of them had previous experience with TS, some all the way back to Amiga days. Many of them tried TS7.6, made a quick attempt with WS side than proclaimed it to be useless and not featured enough and clumsy to work in...

Workflow is always going to be bad as long as Bridge is there and Caligari insists on encouraging user's to use part of Modeler side to do things they have yet to implement on WS... than there is the mindset on the other side.... enough said...


It is nice that the interface can be customized as you choose... buit it requires a bit of knowledge to get it so. Setting hot keys for common tools, setting up the intergface to have the flow you want, and getting enough of the customiaed tools together that are scattered all over these forums to make TS behave in a way that you can work in it as opposed to the herky-jerky feel of it out of the box is another BIG stumbling block. At this point Caligari is trying to woo user's who are familiar with other packages, why not have interface templates that mildly mimic thos, LW, XSI, 3DMax, Maya, Houdini, C4D... when you are the one chasing everyone else it is best to conform to their standard instead of insisting on exclusively using your own. People will flock to a free tool, and they will even push it into their workflow if the tool has similiar feel, keystrokes, layout to what they are using ewveryday...


Things to toss around and think about...


Rich

Post by jamesmc // Sep 19, 2008, 11:27am

jamesmc
Total Posts: 2566
As Rich Levy has stated, the interface can be moved around and customized, but it's more than that, there is a flow management problem.

Ever noticed that WorkSpace is designed for left-handed people? The main dialog boxes are on the right side, contrary to many software packages out there. When panels are on left hand side, I very seldom have to avert my eyes from the center screen. The right hand dialog boxes force me to focus away from center screen. I read from left to right, as I suspect most people do. Having to look over to the right bothers me a lot.

There there is the Link Editor. It's like the pop up cellar from hell on the bottom of the screen. Not only are the nodes poorly organized, there are no sub menus to access specific functions - i.e. if you only want to work in textures, one has to click down, watching the preceding nodes disappear into nothingness. There is no reference dialog box that covers scene management, nor is there one controlling the various aspects of the nodes and their plug-ins. These functions are further buried down several clicks away.

This is akin to book stacking. That is, you have a dozen books and a very small space to work in. In order to work on the book that has textures, one has to unstack the books until they get to the one on textures, then restack the books so the book that is being worked on can be worked on.

If you need to work on another attribute, then mouse clicking your way to the next level of nodes, the current book or node disappears and you must restack the books in order to make room for the new nodes or books.

There is nothing handy to work with there, it is a constant reshuffle of modes and nodes. No referencing dialog boxes and an interruption of the work path.

----------------------------
The other factor is incompleteness. Now that I've moved on to another software package, I am finding just how important bug free, complete start to finish work flow actually is and how very important having tools and menus properly placed is.

Since I'm a person who likes animation, I also find the animation tools for tS very much lacking. The rigging still has bugs in it and is very quirkly. The control of morphs and other attributes is scattered. Some of it in the panel and some of it buried in procedural nodes. This is, in my opinion, contrary to logical work flow. It interrupts the thought process and one must become an interface search hound, instead of an artist trying to complete a work flow.

There are many other reasons, but I have moved on. After using this other application, I"ve become aware that trueSpace is years away from getting where I want to be for work flow. Sorry, but I'm not waiting for that.

Post by transient // Sep 19, 2008, 3:49pm

transient
Total Posts: 977
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So what's this 3d package you've found, James? You keep flaming truespace, but it's a bit unfair taking pot-shots at it without any chance of a defence.


I've had my differences with this application, but I come from a technical, hard-core 3d background, and the grass definitely isn't necessaily greener in other pastures in my experience.


Fact is, if your best efforts in application X resemble gumby on crack, then "moving to a different package" (I always get amused by this) won't help. If anythng, the new learning curve will hinder your progress imo.


The major isue with everyone I've taught 3d to, regardless of their app of choice, is that they lack fundamental art skills. It's these core skills which are by far the most important thing in digital art work. There is an incessant and predictable noise in 3d land about so-called workflow (myself included - see splinter's room's idea ;)), however this is the last thing most 3d users need to worry about in the long-term.


It's their core skills that are lacking, and lacking art and 3d fundamentals are two things that are guaranteed to cause you problems in any package.


My 2c.

Post by jamesmc // Sep 19, 2008, 4:37pm

jamesmc
Total Posts: 2566
So what's this 3d package you've found, James? You keep flaming truespace, but it's a bit unfair taking pot-shots at it without any chance of a defence.

I've had my differences with this application, but I come from a technical, hard-core 3d background, and the grass definitely isn't necessaily greener in other pastures in my experience.

Fact is, if your best efforts in application X resemble gumby on crack, then "moving to a different package" (I always get amused by this) won't help. If anythng, the new learning curve will hinder your progress imo.

The major isue with everyone I've taught 3d to, regardless of their app of choice, is that they lack fundamental art skills. It's these core skills which are by far the most important thing in digital art work. There is an incessant and predictable noise in 3d land about so-called workflow (myself included - see splinter's room's idea ;)), however this is the last thing most 3d users need to worry about in the long-term.

It's their core skills that are lacking, and lacking art and 3d fundamentals are two things that are guaranteed to cause you problems in any package.

My 2c.

Well my core 3D skills are lacking, but I have been doing 2D computer art probably longer than anyone on this forum and know how to read instructions and usually follow them fairly well.

No, I won't tell you the name of the software I'm using now.

All I know and fully realize now that I have the full capability to do what I always wanted to do.

From modeling to commercial production if I want, including compositing, special effects, soft and rigid dynamics, sophisticated camera tools and rigging, morphing, etc. etc. and I don't have to wait on anyone to write a plug-in for it, because it is already there.

BTW, I've already modeled, rigged, UV'd and textured about five human-like characters and animated them since I've had the software. I would say I'm way ahead of the power curve.

But a nice try transient, on taking a shot at me. :)

Post by transient // Sep 19, 2008, 4:54pm

transient
Total Posts: 977
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This is just typical trolling, James. You flame something, somebody calls you out, then you act all pious and try to say I was taking a shot at you.


Not at all.


I just want to know what is so special about the new software you're using. I think I already know what it is, I'm just asking you to be up front and stop the back-stabbing. I also want to know why, after dramatically leaving truespace (yet again), you're still here, stirring up trouble.


I'm sure I'm not the only one.

Post by Steinie // Sep 19, 2008, 5:02pm

Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
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Well I'm glad James is now happy with Software that works for him. He was a trueSpace user so he is not all bad;)

I'm pretty sure others wouldn't mind knowing what he didn't like about tS so that it can improve.

I don't want this thread turning into a flame war against each other.

Post by jamesmc // Sep 19, 2008, 5:18pm

jamesmc
Total Posts: 2566
This is just typical trolling, James. You flame something, somebody calls you out, then you act all pious and try to say I was taking a shot at you.

Not at all.

I just want to know what is so special about the new software you're using. I think I already know what it is, I'm just asking you to be up front and stop the back-stabbing. I also want to know why, after dramatically leaving truespace (yet again), you're still here, stirring up trouble.

I'm sure I'm not the only one.

I already gave my reasons and left it at that. I'm not the one causing problems here.

I gave that information; inhibition to the work flow in the the way I like to do it and the way the interface is designed and implemented.

That, and trueSpace 7.6 is a far from a complete product and that it needs a lot of polishing before it is viable.

Either accept it or reject what I wrote. I don't see any reason to attack me or my qualifications just because I'm truthful about my opinion.

I spent about seven thousand on the software I'm using now, if you must know and I'll leave it at there.

Post by KeithC // Sep 19, 2008, 5:24pm

KeithC
Total Posts: 467
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Sounds like you bought the top-end version of it, James.

Post by transient // Sep 19, 2008, 5:55pm

transient
Total Posts: 977
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I already gave my reasons and left it at that. I'm not the one causing problems here.



Lol. No, I'm sure it's never you.;)


I never attacked your qualifications, my argument was a general opinion about frutrated 3d users in general and wasn't directed at anyone in particular. I was giving my 2c on Richard's issues of teaching truespace to his students - and I wasn't attacking him either, obviously.


Anyway, I disagree with most of what's been said in this thread by others, not just you. I agree with some of it as well, but not as much as I did six months ago.


The only reason I personally have to leave truespace now is to map organic models, which I do in blender. Also, I think 3d Coat is becoming indespensible as well. The other things that irritate me in treuspace are rather minor since the update.


If I was into hard-core character animtion, I wouldn't be into 3d at all as I prefer the 2d kind (something I would love to get back to one day, along with painting).


So don't feel victimised, James. In any case, you've got shiny new uber-software to learn. What are you slumming it with us shmucks for?;)

Post by RichLevy // Sep 19, 2008, 7:33pm

RichLevy
Total Posts: 1140
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Just so no one thinks my post was anything more than what is was, just an observation, something I have seen in other forums when TS is mentioned. I don't have as adverse a reaction to it as them... it's tough being the only one swimming against the tide, sometimes it's nice to drift with the flow.


It's good to see Steinie back at it again... sorry to see James back at it, sigh "again" :o...


Rich

Post by mrbones // Sep 19, 2008, 7:38pm

mrbones
Total Posts: 1280
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Hi James,


You bring up some fair points about TrueSpace workflow shortcoming, not just pot shots.


As much as I hate to agree with you, Im afraid you are right without much eggzazerating.


Back to the drawing board, I always say.


Cheers




As Rich Levy has stated, the interface can be moved around and customized, but it's more than that, there is a flow management problem.


Ever noticed that WorkSpace is designed for left-handed people? The main dialog boxes are on the right side, contrary to many software packages out there. When panels are on left hand side, I very seldom have to avert my eyes from the center screen. The right hand dialog boxes force me to focus away from center screen. I read from left to right, as I suspect most people do. Having to look over to the right bothers me a lot.


There there is the Link Editor. It's like the pop up cellar from hell on the bottom of the screen. Not only are the nodes poorly organized, there are no sub menus to access specific functions - i.e. if you only want to work in textures, one has to click down, watching the preceding nodes disappear into nothingness. There is no reference dialog box that covers scene management, nor is there one controlling the various aspects of the nodes and their plug-ins. These functions are further buried down several clicks away.


This is akin to book stacking. That is, you have a dozen books and a very small space to work in. In order to work on the book that has textures, one has to unstack the books until they get to the one on textures, then restack the books so the book that is being worked on can be worked on.


If you need to work on another attribute, then mouse clicking your way to the next level of nodes, the current book or node disappears and you must restack the books in order to make room for the new nodes or books.


There is nothing handy to work with there, it is a constant reshuffle of modes and nodes. No referencing dialog boxes and an interruption of the work path.


----------------------------

The other factor is incompleteness. Now that I've moved on to another software package, I am finding just how important bug free, complete start to finish work flow actually is and how very important having tools and menus properly placed is.


Since I'm a person who likes animation, I also find the animation tools for tS very much lacking. The rigging still has bugs in it and is very quirkly. The control of morphs and other attributes is scattered. Some of it in the panel and some of it buried in procedural nodes. This is, in my opinion, contrary to logical work flow. It interrupts the thought process and one must become an interface search hound, instead of an artist trying to complete a work flow.


There are many other reasons, but I have moved on. After using this other application, I"ve become aware that trueSpace is years away from getting where I want to be for work flow. Sorry, but I'm not waiting for that.

Post by mrbones // Sep 19, 2008, 7:41pm

mrbones
Total Posts: 1280
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I agree Rich,


I always liked those in screen right click menus too. UI needs to be more streamlined and the LE could be part of right click land so we dont have to dive down and open nodes along the way, although it is nice to be able to see the connections and sub structures..


When the free version came out I made sure a group of digital artist I am a member of were re-introduced to it again (many of them had previous experience with TS, some all the way back to Amiga days. Many of them tried TS7.6, made a quick attempt with WS side than proclaimed it to be useless and not featured enough and clumsy to work in...

Workflow is always going to be bad as long as Bridge is there and Caligari insists on encouraging user's to use part of Modeler side to do things they have yet to implement on WS... than there is the mindset on the other side.... enough said...


It is nice that the interface can be customized as you choose... buit it requires a bit of knowledge to get it so. Setting hot keys for common tools, setting up the intergface to have the flow you want, and getting enough of the customiaed tools together that are scattered all over these forums to make TS behave in a way that you can work in it as opposed to the herky-jerky feel of it out of the box is another BIG stumbling block. At this point Caligari is trying to woo user's who are familiar with other packages, why not have interface templates that mildly mimic thos, LW, XSI, 3DMax, Maya, Houdini, C4D... when you are the one chasing everyone else it is best to conform to their standard instead of insisting on exclusively using your own. People will flock to a free tool, and they will even push it into their workflow if the tool has similiar feel, keystrokes, layout to what they are using ewveryday...


Things to toss around and think about...


Rich

Post by nowherebrain // Sep 29, 2008, 11:54am

nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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Who likes ice cream?

Post by Burnart // Sep 29, 2008, 12:49pm

Burnart
Total Posts: 839
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Icecream is great - boysenberry swirl, chocolate, butterscotch, pistachio mmmm! Lots of great flavours to sample - just like 3d software. Mmmm...3d!

Since 7 came out tS had been a different beast - a VERY different beast. With each subsequent release its got better, - better organised, more tools, more stable. I use workspace more in 7.6 than I did in 7.5 than I did in 7.1 etc. The flavour is improving but there is still a little bitterness on the palette. Improvement is still required. So what else is new?

BTW I dropped the Ambassador icon from my signature - I thought that it was a very specific program related to people recommending the software and gaining subsequent sales. Ie. I recommend it to person A - they buy the software, quote my ambassador number and get a discount and I get kudos with Caligari. Isn't that how it was supposed to work? Anyway, I'm not sure that anyone I recommended tS to ever bought it and now that its free I'm not sure the Ambassador program is still relevant - officially speaking that is.

Post by Weevil // Oct 8, 2008, 1:04am

Weevil
Total Posts: 534
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So back on the 7.6 front. I'm not the only one finding problems with it? If there was a way to have the options of hair and the other new stuff I haven't found yet into the workspace side as a click box options or a new tool button I think it would work better. Having a giant divide down the centre of the program just breaks everything up...not to mention the freezup when you click a wrong button. It's what kept me with ts 6.6.

I think Caligaris trying to ge tnew users in with this new workspace and trying to keep the old users working with it by simply including TS 6 with a lot of lag and uneeded frippery...It just is not working for me.

The fact that the hotkeys, buttons and options change when you cross that bridge makes it a new 'half' program that I will never get to grips with. Unfortunately, I think ts needs to make an advancement of 6.6 not a new program like it's trying to do. It's really a marmite program at the moment.

My opinion

EDIT: Sorry, I never notcied what date this was made, my apologies. I navigate by looking at what everyone else seems to be viewing...it's a way to cut through searching! Because now I notice that this is the ambassadors club.

Whoops

Post by Steinie // Jan 7, 2009, 9:57am

Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
pic
The decisions being made lately by Caligari is mind numbing!
Remember when Eve gave Adam that Apple all hell broke loose. Well I feel the same way about "Free" trueSpace. Their latest decision to stop selling VRay is another example of "it's not free get rid of it!"

Great way to run a Company!

If you want something now, "Make it yourself, we gave you the tools" is the new response.
Well I always wanted to be an Astronaut but I have no storage shed at home for the solid rocket fuel.
Do you really think we are all programmers? Some things are beyond us mere mortals.
I wanted layered materials in VRay, so how do I do that now? Do you believe in Miracles?


p.s. The Gallery prizes are down to two items now but three categories.

Post by Mr. 3d // Jan 7, 2009, 11:32am

Mr. 3d
Total Posts: 747
pic
...No more VRay ! The Gallery prizes are down to two items now.

VRay was the only item in the prize gallery that I was going to shoot for. Now there's no more motivation for me.:(

Post by Nez // Jan 7, 2009, 11:45pm

Nez
Total Posts: 1102
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Well, I think that was true for most people - never saw anyone say they were interested in any of the other prizes.

Clearly there are quite a few folks entering the Gallery competition using VRay already (they usually win, after all) so I guess they won't be too bothered... but pretty sad for all the rest of us.

Post by Steinie // Jan 8, 2009, 1:55am

Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
pic
My friends the audience is changing here. The focus of Caligari is still unclear to me but their latest actions striped any resemblance of a professional application.

Transient said it best, their demographics has changed. Maybe the "free trueSpace" was their parting gift.

Post by transient // Jan 8, 2009, 3:43am

transient
Total Posts: 977
pic
Transient said it best, their demographics has changed.


Dude, where's my vray........

Post by v3rd3 // Jan 8, 2009, 12:19pm

v3rd3
Total Posts: 388
My latest attempt at wit.


To Caligari.... no offense but we are half pregnant.


To Users..... you can't get nine women pregnant and have a baby in a month.


To all, there is a lot of work to transition, integrate, whatever you want to call it, following a corporate merger. I have been through a good 1/2 dozen myself. This transition is no more or less painful than those of any other business. They take time and patience and perseverance and occasionally a large bottle of scotch.


I honestly wish this was a less painful situation. As a user of the product I admit that the lack of clarity regarding the future is frustrating and that I sometimes look for new posts in these forums 12 times a day just because I feel starved of information. I too have a wish list for the future. I hope I see it, it is in the posts of those who have already asked once so I do not see the need to repeat.


TomG, I appreciate the work you are doing. I was in similar shoes a number of times and I know the situation is difficult.


To everyone else, I share your frustration and I hope we can ride out the storm and see the rainbow we are looking for at the other end.


[Insert one of Splinter's rainbows here... irony, it would be rendered with Vray]

Post by Steinie // Jan 10, 2009, 4:32pm

Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
pic
The main focus of trueSpace 7.6 etc is Real Time Rendering.
The main complaint about Real Time Rendering is the quality of the render versus an offline renderer.
Caligari is known for it's Pioneering attitude.
Their marriage with MicroSoft makes me believe they now have the capability to shake up the 3D world.
So wouldn't it make sense to use DX11 next?...

"Support for tessellation, which blurs the line between super high quality pre-rendered scenes and scenes rendered in real-time,
allowing game developers to refine models to be smoother and more attractive when seen up close"

Post by Steinie // Jan 11, 2009, 7:21am

Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
pic
Well there is great news coming from the Beta Team Camp. In another thread Jack E. announced that some members of the Beta Team (Dele, Jack, Frootee and others) are working on a plug in for the Yafray renderer working with the workSpace side of trueSpace. Yafray has full GI and HDRI Ilumination. This is badly needed since the halt of development for VRAy. Once the plugin is coded a Kerkythea renderer could possibly follow too.

News from the Dribble camp states there is another update in the works and he also plans to support Darktree materials in the future.
Simon has said all along he will write a plug in for Dribble on the workSpace side. That is putting a Film quality $1000 renderer in the hands of a trueSpace user for peanuts!

On a side note I'm not convinced Kekythea will remain free. On their Web site I noticed the statement "Stay assured that our next edition will bring a lot of improvements in features, quality and speed but will also signal a new era for our Thea render engine" They also have a poll asking "What is the price of your most used rendering solution (besides Kerkythea)?" Hmmmm, sounds like a new era to me.
Stay tune for developments...

Post by splinters // Jan 11, 2009, 12:42pm

splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Remember though that Vray development is not necessarily halted (although I have my doubts) just not for sale!


As for Dribble, I have not been around here much of late but I cannot remember seeing any updates. Is there any public news or is this between you and Simon?


Thanks for the updates though...:)

Post by v3rd3 // Jan 11, 2009, 1:22pm

v3rd3
Total Posts: 388
On a side note I'm not convinced Kekythea will remain free. On their Web site I noticed the statement "Stay assured that our next edition will bring a lot of improvements in features, quality and speed but will also signal a new era for our Thea render engine" They also have a poll asking "What is the price of your most used rendering solution (besides Kerkythea)?" Hmmmm, sounds like a new era to me.

Stay tune for developments...


I agree with you 100% on this one.....

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