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Collaboration questions
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They are retained here for archive purposes only.
Collaboration questions // Archive: Tech Forum
Post by splinters // Sep 6, 2007, 6:01am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Ok, back to school again and I have the collaboration bug again. Never been able to explore the use of shared space to teach but it is a very interesting concept. However, I have a few questions:
1. Can a tP user drop objects into a scene or indeed take them out for use in perhaps an earlier version of trueSpace.
2. Cost would prohibit many students from purchasing a full version of tS so can they go to shared space using the demo and watch me demonstrating (something) using my version of tS7.51?
3. Could they then take objects from the scene and save them into their demo versions of tS?
4. In light of the above is there any chance of a shared space educational version of tS for students? No sure how it might differ from the full version but I cannot really afford to buy 30 or 40 copies of tS just now...:o
Just speculating right now and I realise that the biggest hurdle is the fact that many have earlier versions of tS but workspace objects would not be compatible unless they had a save as...function. |
Post by frootee // Sep 6, 2007, 6:32am
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frootee
Total Posts: 2667
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Hi Splinters.
I do not believe trueplay users can drop objects into scenes; trueplay is basically a Read Only application. However, I could be wrong on this one since I have never tried it. I do not think it is possible to save files as .COB (ts 6.6 and older) file formats.
Truespace 7.51 Demo users CAN go to shared space to watch your work. Instructions for configuring truespace can be found here:
http://forums1.caligari.com/truespace/showpost.php?p=43977&postcount=30
When following the instructions referenced above, make sure that you and your students are all using the same portal: tsportal, or tpportal.
The demo version of truespace 7.51 is save-disabled.
HTH
Froo
Ok, back to school again and I have the collaboration bug again. Never been able to explore the use of shared space to teach but it is a very interesting concept. However, I have a few questions:
1. Can a tP user drop objects into a scene or indeed take them out for use in perhaps an earlier version of trueSpace.
2. Cost would prohibit many students from purchasing a full version of tS so can they go to shared space using the demo and watch me demonstrating (something) using my version of tS7.51?
3. Could they then take objects from the scene and save them into their demo versions of tS?
4. In light of the above is there any chance of a shared space educational version of tS for students? No sure how it might differ from the full version but I cannot really afford to buy 30 or 40 copies of tS just now...:o
Just speculating right now and I realise that the biggest hurdle is the fact that many have earlier versions of tS but workspace objects would not be compatible unless they had a save as...function. |
Post by TomG // Sep 6, 2007, 7:05am
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TomG
Total Posts: 3397
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Hi all,
tP owners can't add or save objects - this is for security, since otherwise any site open to tP would allow people to "steal" the content in there. The concept is this - a protected site (say your own room with your own unique content) can only be accessed by tP, and so this protects your objects from being copied.
A general, shareable site is open to users with tS, where naturally they can copy work, so you know not to load up anything proprietary into the shared space.
So it is deliberate that it works that way.
tS trial version owners can enter shared space, and they can take part in modeling. They cannot however save objects, as the trial version is saved disabled. Again no way to change this and it is deliberate - we think timed trials are not good, we would rather give people all the time in the world to try it out, and give them all the tools. The only thing then that can be removed to stop it being a full version is the option to save :)
For the ability to "take objects home" then yes each person would need a copy of tS7.5. The other option is simply to give the live demo then simply mail out (or otherwise distribute) the course resources for use by the students in earlier versions of tS. Note that with the trial, they can be modeling away so the live sessions retain all the functionality while they take place (they just can't save the work for later).
Also note that with tP you can set up controlled interactivity for them - eg you want them to take apart an engine, you can script the engine so that they click on what to remove next, and you can rate their performance at copying what you just showed them on how to do it.
You could also create a scripted object that when clicked on added an object to the scene, so you could let each student add their own engine for example to go off and work on - so the functionality that tP has is determined by the environment that the tS7.5 author has given it, and you can add specific functionality as needed.
All these options allow for full, live interactivity and activities without the need for multiple copies of tS.
However, for taking it away and working in other versions of tS, this is not possible.
Naturally educational pricing is available for tS7 (and all tS versions), simply contact Customer Services and they'd be happy to discuss it with you!
So in short
1. No to both
2. Absolutely yes, this is what tP is all about
3. No (but you can distribute the course resources by other "conventional" means)
4. Yes educational pricing, please contact Customer Services.
HTH!
Tom |
Post by 3dvisuals dude // Sep 6, 2007, 7:24am
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3dvisuals dude
Total Posts: 1703
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Ok, back to school again and I have the collaboration bug again. Never been able to explore the use of shared space to teach but it is a very interesting concept. However, I have a few questions:
1. Can a tP user drop objects into a scene or indeed take them out for use in perhaps an earlier version of trueSpace.
2. Cost would prohibit many students from purchasing a full version of tS so can they go to shared space using the demo and watch me demonstrating (something) using my version of tS7.51?
3. Could they then take objects from the scene and save them into their demo versions of tS?
4. In light of the above is there any chance of a shared space educational version of tS for students? No sure how it might differ from the full version but I cannot really afford to buy 30 or 40 copies of tS just now...:o
Just speculating right now and I realise that the biggest hurdle is the fact that many have earlier versions of tS but workspace objects would not be compatible unless they had a save as...function.
Hi Splinters,
I've never used the demo of trueSpace so I have no idea on it's related uses or limitations for your collaborative scenario above.
That said, I do know quite a few ways in which one could utilize one license of trueSpace7.5x with a large number of truePlay1.3 users in a collaborative teaching manner both online and offline. Before getting into some of those let me first answer your specific questions above:
1) No, truePlay1.3 users cannot drag and drop objects.
2) Yes. They can go watch your trueSpace7.51 online presentation using either truePlay1.3 or trueSpace7.5Demo to do so.
3) Unknown to me. It seems unlikely to me that the TSdemo can save.
You could of course save any scene or object (even fully scripted ones) using your TS7.51 and upload it somewhere aside from shared space as a zipfile for them to download, unzip, and load with either trueSpace7.5Demo or truePlay1.3.
4) Only Caligari can answer this one.
-----------------------------------
I agree with you completely that the use of shared space as a teaching environment is a very interesting concept.
As far as offline preparation for an online multi-user session, if you want your students to be able to explore your scenes and objects which you have created for them, they will be able to do that with either truePlay1.3 or trueSpace7.5Demo by loading them from their own hard drives into either application. You'd just have to prepare the files for them beforehand.
**If** The TS7.5Demo IS capable of drag and drop and they have both it AND trueplay1.3 open simultaneously they should then be able to drag any objects you have created for them into truePlay1.3 scenes
If you had only two licenses for trueSpace7.51 or a network license, you could have two computers in a classroom running trueSpace7.51 (one for your use and one for supervised use by the students) both connect simultaneously to the same shared space portal and actually perform realtime modeling as well as all other collaborative uses of the program live. In that scenario, you could have small groups of students (if your class is large) also log in to that same realtime session wwith additional computers using either truePlay1.3 or trueSpace7.5Demo to observe it live as well as chat live with you in that same realtime shared space environment.
In determining the best approach in each instance it largely boils down to how much genuine interactive capability do you wish each of your students to have. If their role will be passive in a modeling or file i/o sense, they can do most anything else with either truePlay1.3 or the TS7.5Demo.
There have been some recent breakthroughs here with scripting aside from the "game-engine-like" variety which could also be utilized very effectively for your deployment in a teaching environment.
You can now, for instance, utilize any model you create or place within a trueSpace7.51 Scene to open any program, webpage, local document, or audio message file with a simple left-click inside truePlay1.3, the TSDemo, or online shared space.
You can also have slideshow objects inside your scenes (I discovered this last night) utilizing images of any size you wish in any scene or shared space environment.
There are thousands of ways to use these tools together for teaching environments both online and offline. Many are simply not developed yet, or not developed fully, but in either case, if you are determined to do this I will help you achieve it myself if you like, just let me know.
- Mark / 3dvisuals dude |
Post by splinters // Sep 6, 2007, 8:06am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Thanks for the prompt reply guys. Really could be an exciting avenue to explore...:D |
Post by 3dvisuals dude // Sep 6, 2007, 8:17am
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3dvisuals dude
Total Posts: 1703
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Thanks for the prompt reply guys. Really could be an exciting avenue to explore...:D
I agree!
It seems like every time I go digging into existing scripted objects lately both online and offline I keep seeing new ways to use some of the methods employed for new features of some existing under-developed or new undeveloped tools we can all use for developing our own environments. Many of those would be handy in a teaching environment too.
The more we understand about your specific desires in this regard the more we would all be able to keep our eyes out on ways we could help you achieve this well. In the months and years ahead truePlay and trueSpace will get much more feature-rich too, but right now we can develop scripting for specific teaching and collaborative setting-related functions, and we should.
That "slide show" capability I discovered last night, for instance, could be developed in new ways to provide not only scripted image options, but scripted object loading or scene loading options inside truePlay1.3.:D
- Mark / 3dvisuals dude |
Post by splinters // Sep 6, 2007, 10:02am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Slide show?
tell me more...
Actually I am still thinking how I can teach such a hands on subject as Design and Technology using shared space, apart from the obvious tS tuition.
As I know, I will let you know.
Sorry for what might seem like obvious questions from an 'old timer' like me...just been out of the loop since I left Beta and need to get back in the tS saddle...:D |
Post by 3dvisuals dude // Sep 6, 2007, 10:21am
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3dvisuals dude
Total Posts: 1703
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Slide show?
tell me more...
Actually I am still thinking how I can teach such a hands on subject as Design and Technology using shared space, apart from the obvious tS tuition.
As I know, I will let you know.
Sorry for what might seem like obvious questions from an 'old timer' like me...just been out of the loop since I left Beta and need to get back in the tS saddle...:D
Regarding the "slideshow"... I was in the Caligari shared space portal last night alone and started wandering throughout the scenes there on the shared space server examining all the scripts there inside my Link Editor.
I was in the "Living Room" area and was examining the scripting of the "hi fi" object in that room. Basically this is the entertainment center there which serves up several bitmap images in sequence (each of which can be imported from disk or web). As a user in there clicks the hi-fi object just above where it says "display images" in that scene, the large picture on the wall above that hi-fi object shows a series of images one after another in a loop as the user repeatedly clicks upon that hi-fi object within the scene.
This script is great, but it can be modified in many ways to be far greater for teaching and business presentation uses, and you can be certain I'll be attempting to do that myself in the months ahead as well as looking around sharply for code I can inject into that script to make it more versatile. I've already started playing with it but even as it is in it's current form in the "Living Room" it can be brought up in the TS7.51 Link Editor and selected, and then "harvested" as they say here by saving that selected script object from the LE to the stack as an RsObj object for further offline study and experimentation by anyone with TS7.51.
RIght now it's already a great tool for your intended use, but I definitely intend to make it a lot better soon.:D
- Mark / 3dvisuals dude |
Post by 3dvisuals dude // Sep 6, 2007, 11:01am
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3dvisuals dude
Total Posts: 1703
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I was just thinking about that Caligari University building you put here a while back in the collaboration area of the forums.
Using the same "harvesting" method I described above in detail, you can do the same thing and save that same "hi-fi" scripted object to your stack as an RsObj format scripted object. Then go offline, load that Caligari University into your WOrkspace, and drag that saved Hi-Fi object into a room of your University scene, adjust it's 3D location to a room wall, go into your Link Editor and examine how the images are loaded into that object, load your own, and test it right in your scene offline yourself.
Once you've done this, using the LE will become second nature for such modifications of your offline scenes. WHen you get good at it you can save such scenes as trueSpace7.51 "rcd" format recordings too (which are very compact) or as RsScn format scenes. AS such, you can burn them to CD and distribute then to your students for use via truePlay1.3, which has a dropdown menu allowing them to load and explore such scenes inside truePlay1.3 offline.:)
Maybe it's time to revisit your University object from a new perspective.:)
- Mark / 3dvisuals dude |
Post by 3dvisuals dude // Sep 6, 2007, 11:27am
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3dvisuals dude
Total Posts: 1703
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Duoh... I forgot something else which you may be able to use in that Caligari University for your students offline... I developed a new way for you to give pre-recorded audio presentations inside your scenes as well.
A free scripted "kiosk" RsObj file in zip format is in the following thread along with complete explanations on various ways to use it.
If you have any questions on it let me know, I'm sure we could help you make it an easy tool for teaching purposes.
http://forums1.caligari.com/truespace/showthread.php?t=4001
- Mark / 3dvisuals dude |
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